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The Doc Answers 39

Material posted here is intended for educational purposes only, and must not be considered a substitute for informed advice from your own health care provider.

Courtesy of Dr. Irene Matiatos   Copyright© 2009. The material on this website may be distributed freely for non-commercial or educational purposes provided that author credit is given. For commercial distribution, please contact the author at Doc@drirene.com 

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Saturday August 04, 2007
07:57 PM
Dear Dr. Irene, Born in 1954, married in 1979, I have three daughters ranging from 14 to 23. My engineering-type husband has made a 180-degree radical change as I have gone back into counseling for myself with the counselor with whom we were in marriage therapy with for 9 months a couple of years ago. I began an exercise program to help cope with living with a toxic verbally and emotionally abusive man whom I could, previously, rarely please.
Excellent!!! I'm so happy to hear you have done good things for you! He now sees my pain and says how sorry he is and how much he loves and cherishes me. I am not moved. I understand. You have no reason to trust a quick radical change, nor should you. Yikes…. He now embraces the same Christian beliefs as I, which he had previously balked against for six years. The question is can he maintain his faith - and his appreciation for you - for himself. Not because he is frightened that he may lose you. My interior design ideas are wonderful. He even likes our third dog, which he previously disliked. *Giggle!* My 14 year old wondered if he is “on drugs,” although commented that she likes the “new” Dad. He is not negative. Reading through Lundy Bancroft’s book, “Why Does He Do That” he mentions that change does not happen like this. It seems disingenuous to me. Exactly. Although, there is a percentage of men, somewhere around 20% last I heard, that just "correct" when the partner put her (or his) foot down permanently. I am learning to trust my instincts. Good! They say that there’s more to this than meets the eye. Trust thy Self.  I am concerned about sexual infidelity. He recently asked one of my friends three times in the same conversation whether I was interested in someone else.  At one time he asked my therapist if I was having an affair. She thinks its just projection on his part. He asked me twice in the same hour one day last week and I told him that I was absolutely not interested in anyone else and to never ask me that question again. Maybe it is time to investigate him. There is no way to know. People who see their partner find new strength often suspect infidelity. Others suspect infidelity because they are, or have been guilty of it themselves. Although I have never considered the “D” word, I am now thinking there might be life after divorce. The thought of going through a divorce while my youngest daughter is still a minor greatly disturbs me. I want to learn the skills that will prevent me from enabling his bad behavior so I can model more assertiveness and less passivity. Please advise. Just keep doing what you are doing. It is resulting in positive changes in yourself, and apparently has affected your husband as well. (YAY!) Why not wait and see how things pan out? Certainly there is life after divorce. Especially if you are prepared, so understand how you will need to proceed if need be - and do that now in case timely preparations are necessary. Knowledge is Power. But, why push things now? Do you secretly want out? Do you feel nothing he does will ever restore your feelings for him, or your trust in him? Do you feel guilty because you think you'll never trust him again, etc? Whatever your reasons, pay attention to them to better understand yourself - and internally deal with whatever thoughts and feelings you have. It's OK not to trust him. You don't have to do anything about it now. Especially since husband has been behaving and you want to maintain the marriage for your daughter.So unless something tumultuous happens in your marriage, continue on your present path. It is a good one. Use this time to work on yourself, to become more and more assertive and secure in yourself and in your personal power. Only time will tell where hubby will go. God bless. Dr. Irene


Thursday August 09, 2007
01:28 PM
Dear Dr Irene, My relationship with K started 2,5 years ago and I still don’t understand him. While he can be really romantic and sensible, we fight about trivial things. This is really stressful and I can’t handle it.
Listen to your body: don't handle it!!! (I read ahead.)Let me describe some incidents: He said something bad about me and I replied that somebody else would like that on me. I'm sure they would! He went crazy after that. Ugh! He implied having an affair with another girl, so I told him we should break up. YES! He called later to tell me he lied about the girl and that he loved me so I invited him to a party. He just came to force me to leave with him. Later he excused himself saying he was still angry and he was afraid of hitting someone. The next day we went out when all of a sudden, he told me he couldn’t be with a girl dressed like me and that he would leave. I got into panic and tried to hold him. He hit me, not really hard, but I was shocked. Oh boy... Afterwards, he apologized saying he just thought I was trying to humiliate him. Do I provoke this kind of treatment by being too harsh? NO!!! He is creating all of this craziness. And there is no excuse for hitting. Sometimes I try to seem too invulnerable or I insist in seeing him and get upset when he cancels our plans. Do you think he is just insecure or controlling? Both, and then some. I think he's a really sick puppy. When he excuses himself for not contacting he says he had to teach a lesson Yuk!!! and that everything would be fine if I changed. Wrong. When I cry after a fight he often says my tears are showing weakness or hypocrisy and are disgusting. Don't you see: you are not the problem; the problem is the way he interprets the world. He creates problems where there are none. He will unfortunately continue to do this. What you describe is consistent with a personality disorder, probably BPD.Now we have broken up. Thank God. He has been looking suspicious for a week, then he disappeared for a day and when I asked him why he did that he called me a prostitute without explaining his problem. Now I start to forget my anger and miss him and although I won’t communicate with him I am not sure I won’t forgive him if he comes back. I am confused! Thank you for your help. Sweetie, do yourself a BIG favor and RUN. Get away from this guy ASAP. You are already showing abuse victim symptoms: you doubt yourself and buy into his crazy thinking. He will bring you nothing but grief and life will be a rollercoaster, with the bad parts getting uglier. Sure you will miss him for a while as you get over him, but is this craziness what you want in your life? You want to be going through the same ups and downs 5 years from now?I can promise you one thing: stay and watch things go from bad to worse. I strongly suggest you leave - even if he hadn't hit you! (That's how nutty he sounds.)  But physical violence, for any reason, is a dealbreaker. It often starts lightly, sometimes as an "accident." And it escalates. If he is indeed BPD, as he sounds, he can become truly dangerous. You are on a very destructive and dangerous path with this man. I hope this is clear enough. Bite the bullet and free yourself. Go to TheCatBox, you'll get lots of free support there... My best wishes to you... Doc


Tuesday September 11, 2007
12:18 PM
Dear Dr. Irene- I really like your site and think that it has great information. I am married with two kids and I don’t know if I am in an abusive situation but there are a few things that are bothering me. My husband has been increasingly angry and irritable over the last two years. Our oldest child is three years old and lately my husband’s anger seems to be directed at my son.
That's not fair to your son! I can’t stand the way he talks to our son, he is very disrespectful and harsh. Abuse. He makes our son apologize ( something he tries to do with me as well). I can’t understand this as I don’t see the value in a coerced apology. There isn't any. Childrearing is not about breaking a child's will, and that is what coerced apology is about. This is emotional abuse. Recently my husband spanked our son in anger. Spanking especially in anger is not OK. There are far better ways to child discipline. I've included a few books below. We have agreed not to spank and I confronted my husband about it. His response was to justify it by saying that a lot of people spank their kids. I think you need to be concerned given that he is targeting that child. I told him that it still wasn’t okay with me because we have to agree on it. I think that he may be spanking our son behind my back, because I’ve heard it from the other room. Not OK. I have a gut feeling that the anger that is coming out towards our son is anger towards me. That's probably a good guess. Whenever I try to talk to my husband about it he tries to blame me saying that I am too permissive and he is trying to make up for it. Tell him that you will not tolerate child abuse and there is no need for him to "make up" for anything! My question is: What is the line between discipline and abuse? Respect. If the child is disrespected in any way, that is abusive. Basically good discipline offers rewards for behavior we want more of; it offers incentives to earn wanted stuff for good behavior; it ignores the little icky stuff; it times out (to create boredom) for repeated misbehavior. The child's right to choose is respected. If the consequences are laid out ahead of time, and Junior chooses to touch the hot burner, he will feel the heat. If Junior chooses to scream all night and keep you up, he will not get TV in the morning before school. Etc. It is administered without any anger at all. It is not about yelling or hitting.  It is painful for me to watch and I can’t seem to get my husband to see my point of view. My husband recently took a job where he travels about half of the month and I am beginning to think that it is better for the family when he is gone. You may need to get some professional help to get this to stop. Think about some family therapy with hubby for starters, or go alone if he won't go. But, for your child's sake, do not let him continue this abusive behavior with your child.A few books to consider:Kid Cooperation : How to Stop Yelling, Nagging and Pleading and Get Kids to Cooperate by Elizabeth Pantley.Canter & Canter's Assertive Discipline for Children  Incredible Years : A Troubleshooting Guide for Parents of Children Aged 3 to 8  by Carolyn Webster-Stratton.  Thank you, K Good luck to you guys! Irene


Monday September 16, 2007
05:20 PM
I am a 45 year old female who was raised by a bullying mother, no matter what I did in this life I was never good enough, through out most of my teens and young adulthood I made extremely bad choices based on my need to feel loved. I had some tragic things happen and so I married the first man to come along so I could run as far away from my demons as I could. Unfortunately, I married a man who was older and very much to my surprise, a lot like my mother. Before my mother passed away, I tired to talk to her and her response to me was that she prayed to God to forgive her for what I think she did to me. My mother passed away three years ago and I left my marriage of 20+ years and have begun to start over from scratch. I don’t feel much these days, no anger, nothing. I have been in therapy for two years but it is a slow process for someone who likes tangible returns. I am learning more and more each day. I am in my first relationship since my husband and low and behold he is a verbal abuser. I stay because I'm scared of the unknown and that any attention to include bad attention is better than no attention. I have felt so alone my whole life and crave any recognition of my being.   My question to you is this: I am an intelligent woman and I know the whys of the abuser, I know the whys of why I stay and why I subject myself to this abuse, I know it’s wrong and it has made my self esteem go from low to lower, consciously I know all of this. So how do I reach the subconscious part of me that holds onto these beliefs that I deserve this abuse; that I am so screwed up that no one will love me, all of those thoughts all of us in abusive relationships have. My intellect knows right from wrong but my subconscious seems to fight my conscious and it is a never ending battle. How does one truly come to believe, especially at my age?I feel that time is running out and I feel stuck. I would also like your advice as to whether you support subconscious work with hypnosis; I can’t seem to get there from here. Dear..., You are asking an age-old question: how to get from here to there. Knowing the problem, as you do, is the biggest step - and, good for you, you do. And good for you for having the courage to do all that you have already done! Alas, as you know, knowing is not enough. Also, change does not happen overnight, and unless we change internally, we are likely to recreate the old with the new. This too  you know.Unfortunately, there is no magic bullet. Each theoretical orientation has its own method to guide you to your towards your goal. They all boil down to the same thing in the end: hyper-awareness of your inner life and making the behavioral choices that are likely to get you there. Over and over again, you will find yourself going through subtler and subtler layers and layers of same 'ol same ol' until one day, finally, you have extricated yourself.You feel stuck. OK. Good for you for recognizing your stuckedness; you need to do that to unstick. From what you say, it sounds like an internal battle between doing what you believe you think you should do vs. doing what will help you feel OK in the present moment -  even though feeling OK in the present moment may run contrary to supporting your long-term  goals. It seems that you are too-often choosing the shot-term solution (feel good now) over the harder, long-term response that will support your goals and values over your immediate emotional state. I think you understand most of that, but you are having difficulty dealing with the repercussions of doing what is right for you.  Facing the fear of being alone, of the unknown, is very difficult for many people; that is usually why people get stuck. I hope that you slowly let yourself out of your prison by gradually allowing yourself to face your fears, including dealing with life without the attention you think you need. In is the only way out.  In any case, you must come to terms that you can't have your cake and eat it too. And you also must come to terms with the fact that it will take as long as it takes. And, you must come to terms with the fact that you are the only one to make the choices to stay where you are or to move past them. Only you. Each of us creates our own experience. Each of us create our own prison. The good news is that since we create them, we can tear them down. It is difficult work, but you can extricate yourself from your fears and your "need" for attention. That is freedom.  Will hypnosis help? Perhaps. Sometimes a different approach sparks a new effect. Talk to your therapist about adding a hypnosis trial over whatever work you are already doing. Any way you find to help you free yourself is well worth it.   Wishing you the best, Dr. Irene

Tuesday October 02, 2007
01:13 AM
Dear Dr. Irene, I need to let you know about "weird happenings" with my H of 27+ years since he made a radical 180 degree turn when he saw I was changing. Two months ago you said to see how things would pan out. Here is the update: He is still being "Mr. Nice" (Fortunately he is exercising 1-2 hours/day). He has seen a counselor 3X. (Not sure what the topic is.) Doesn’t matter. There are no changes after 3X. Maybe, maybe after 6 months, a year, there are some changes. He still seems fake to me. I do not trust him. I do not want him to touch me. If you do not want him to touch you, do not let him touch you. If you do not trust him, do not trust him. If he seems fake to you, you need to trust yourself. Do trust and respect your feelings. I am able to be kind to him and wish him well Good for you! but I do not want to be married to him. Good to know your own mind. I have seen a collaborative attorney for a consultation. He tells me he is so sorry he hurt me because he was full of bitterness and would like us to begin marriage therapy again. Now he likes EVERYTHING I do and has me on a pedestal. The key word is “now.” If ugly things have happened before, they will happen again – simply because he knows no other way to be when the pain inherent in everyday life hits him.  (Ugh!) Weird happenings: He stalked me at 24hr fitness one morning. Not OK! Any kind of stalking is not OK. That is controlling behavior. I came home one day to find my name spelled out in pennies, "I Love" spelled out in nickles, and "You" spelled out in dimes on the counter of our master bathroom. Oh boy… Emotionally manipulative too. Change takes time. Lots of it.He has a "voice change" that sounds like a 12 year old when he is apologetic or is trying to convince me that he trusts me or has never been unfaithful to me… Finding his gun that I hid and then him hiding it....asking one of his coworkers about a gun for sale....Telling me he would never hurt me and would lay down his life for me. Whispering "I love you...love you...as I am falling asleep and last night after I had been asleep for about 1 hour I awoke hearing him say.."I love you and want to be with you forever" (After that I was sort of freaked out Of course!!! and could not sleep so eventually got up and ate some cereal and took an Ambien and slept for 4 hours.) Telling me he is after my heart and my mind. There is more but no room... I think I got it. Listen to your body. Unlike some Humans you may know, it does not lie. Which brings me to my question to you: There is absolutely nothing - nothing - in this email that suggests wanting to stay with him. So, why did you spend your money to write?  :)   Because you don't trust yourSelf and had to hear it from an expert. Yet, all I did is parrot back agreement. So, what is your lesson? :)  That you have the right to your own thoughts and feelings. Nobody else has to agree with you. Once you understand what your body is telling you, you are free to exercise your will and choose a path. OK? Learn to trust yourself. Your body has been giving you very strong signals on this one. Wishing you the very best, Dr. Irene

Friday October 19, 2007
09:29 PM
Finding your site has been an epiphany. Dad was the abuser & mum the victim although she was always the one who got us into trouble with him.
:(  She co-conspires...  I'm about to go home to visit my parents in Ireland with my 2 small children, 4 & 3. My abusive husband recently left me after raping me & I dearly want to meet & spend time with an old school friend who has supported me thro this crisis ( my parents don't know about the rape). My mother has had recent surgery but will have been home for several weeks. Dad has already put his foot down that "she wont be well enough to have visitors" so I'm already being pressured into not seeing my friend. Not OK. Go spend a few days at your friend's place! Or spend time with your friend outside of the parental home.I feel very strongly now is the time to make my stand with BOTH my parents over the abuse/control/ manipulation issues. I am a GP so supposedly a skilled communicator but being with my folks reduces me to a teary 5 yr old every time. On every visit they find a way to cause a screaming match (usually over me daring to go out with an old friend, or go against their wishes) & I don't want my children traumatized any further. I'm even thinking of not staying with them. HELP! Not staying with them is probably a good idea; especially now since mum is sick and you don't want to tax her health. Great excuse! *giggle*That's a reasonable short-term solution, though they'll probably give you a hard time if you stay with them - and a hard time if you don't. But you can stick to your guns about not wanting to tire poor mum.You could confront your parents about abuse issues, but do you think it will  make a dent? And it's admirable that you want to do that, but I think you may want to wait until you're in a stronger emotional space. When you're very strong, it won't matter at all whether you do or you don't.Confront them if you must, but recognize the probability of getting what you want from them is not very high given what you've told me.Focus your energy on detaching emotionally from their judgments of you - from anybody's judgments of you! Otherwise, you remain chained to them, a prisoner, caring too much about what they say or think.  What they say and think really doesn't matter if you think about it. It matters that you care so much about it... At some level, you're still seeking their approval. You haven't come to terms with the fact that you'll probably never get it - and that it is sad but purrrfectly OK if you don't.As you take yourself out of this place of seeking approval, be it from husband, parents, etc., you begin to remove yourself from the probability of becoming somebody's victim.
I'm talking about, over time, developing greater trust in yourself and not second-guessing yourself over what others may think. Now that's is freedom Doc! See how abuse really is an equal-opportunity employer?Sending you lots of virtual hugs and well-wishes. Dr. Irene

Wednesday, October 24Dear Dr. Irene, I am looking for clarification I suppose.
  I can’t tell you what a relief it was to find your website which answered so many questions for me.  I have been married to my husband for six years, and when I met him he made me feel so incredibly special all the time.  It was only small things that bothered me before (name calling, and when his children were around he would treat me with no respect) Eeeks! These are not small things!!!! and then about 6 months ago it was like someone had taken over his body.  I really thought he hated me by the way he spoke, things he said and tone of his voice.  I truly couldn’t understand it and even my family thought he had found someone else.  I think he is just not controlling himself and now just says what he wants.  There is small periods of the nice side but I almost feel it is an effort for him and being nasty is his comfortable side.  My problem is that I have never been one for putting up with being treated bad and at first I would not speak to him.  Lol! It is not a problem to not put up with being treated bad! Then it escalated to me driving around for hours because I was so hurt.  Then came the threatening to leave.  Each time he would repent and life would go on.  It then reached a point where I left with my son and drove seven hours to go home to my family.  I suppose because I keep going back he feels I will never really leave. Yes. I have told him that I feel he is a verbal abuser and he tells me that I am the one. Nonsense. You make a complaint, and he counters by accusing you of same. Abusive people tend to use that strategy as a way of deflecting answering your question. I am worried that I have some of these traits also since when I would be upset with him I can go for a couple of days without speaking to him.  Maybe you do; most likely you are just angry. Most of us get angry when we let others push our buttons. Most of us don't have good assertion skills, so we scream and yell and act ickily. You should feel angry when provoked! However, when you act out your anger ickily, he uses it against you.  Don't forget, abuse is not about being or acting angry, it is about control. I suppose I take things he says too hard. Yes, that's a normal reaction and is how most people respond. It's hard to disengage emotionally and realize that the icky stuff he says says more about him than about you... but I don’t feel I should be treated that way Correct! Our arguments turn into screaming matches and we can’t discuss our problem. There is nothing to discuss. Every time you point out to him what he's doing, he appears to use your (normal, yet unassertive) behaviors against you. So stop trying to tell him anything. It doesn't matter anyway, and he doesn't have to agree. You're not going to change him. Accept that.Every time we argue now he tells me he wants a divorce. Lol! Tell him it will be your pleasure! What do you think would be his reaction if you really meant that?  I am so confused on how much of this is my fault and I am afraid that I don’t have the courage to leave. In your fear, you have given him power over you. Your job is to stand on your own two feet, and once you are there, decide what to do. Not now. I have always only wanted to be married and have a family so I never went for any training and I am now 47.  I have a job where I don’t make much money and I would have to go back home and start all over again.  Not only that, it hurts when I think of this marriage being over because it was so good at one time and I get those few moments still.  Any advise? Yes.Thank you, L   You are stuck in the typical abuse mess. You need some help because you don't see how you let him intimidate you out of your fear of losing him. You don't see how your need to depend on him/ have him be normal keeps you stuck and produces soooo much pain... You have to get on your own two feet. Get some counseling to help clear the confusion. Figure out what kind of retraining you'll need to be able to get a job to support yourself, and get it now, while you are married. Talk to an attorney to get an idea of how much support you are likely entitled to. Forty-seven is young. You have the whole second half of your life in front of you! Wishing you the very best, Doc


Tuesday, October 30 
I think my husband is a bit narcissistic.  He never takes blame for anything its always someone else's fault, usually mine..... Let's first call it "responsibility for" instead of "blame" - because that's what it is. :) Right down to his constipation!. Amazing... This weekend out of the blue he was in a bad mood  My third grade daughter and I went all out for a Halloween dance party.  We bought decorations, food, lights, went all out; there were like 14 friends from school, some parents, and they just loved the party.  Anyway, after the party got started I ran upstairs to get drinks for a couple parents. I was running around like a chicken with no head while my husband is on the couch sulking because there was nothing to eat. Well, obviously you are to blame! LOL!! :)  First of all, I had ordered 5 pizzas. Immediately he shoved a piece in his mouth, even though I told him to wait a bit.  I wasn't ready to give it out yet because Dominos came early.  He was complaining there was nothing to eat and he was starving and he can't believe how inadequate (or something to that effect) I am at providing food for my family! I'm like what? You're joking? Sure I will whip up a 7 course meal with 20 people in the basement while I'm dancing, playing games and entertaining them.  Is he kidding? What is wrong with pizza? Absolutely nothing is wrong with pizza, but what is wrong is his demanding way that doesn't take others (you and those at the party) into consideration. So you are mad! And with good reason.I think he thinks I live to stand around and feed him.  Probably. I said, "You don't look like your starving." He said, "Well I am. I'm also constipated!" I wanted to die laughing!  *Giggle!* First of all, I cook every day.  Some days I make great homemade meals, some days not at all because we are very busy, the kids are in all activities.  HE never thanks me, he just sits and eats. I don't want sex with him and I know no sex makes him grouchier - I just have too much anger to ignore.  I don't know what to do.  Now he is trying to be nice because he knows he was a jerk. Yep. That's the rollercoaster, and you're riding high, but at least your situation doesn't sound dangerous. Perhaps you can learn to disengage from his stuff - or you can leave him - or anywhere in-between. The first is the least drastic solution.Pain is a part of life but agony is optional. The sooner you accept that he is the way he is and likely will not change, the sooner you will achieve peace of mind. This is called "Radical Acceptance." Why spend so much time and energy being angry? He's annoying, but you create your anger!  (And he creates his.) For example, do you make yourself so angry when you go shopping and find the purrrrfect pink polka dot skirt - but, its not in your size? Maybe you frantically search through the racks, ask the sales help to look in the back, or check  availability in another store. If all your attempts fail, you probably feel disappointed. Darn it! And let it go at that. You accept reality. It is what it is: no skirt.  Consider accepting reality regarding your husband. He is who he is and wants what he wants when he wants when he wants it. And, he blames you for everything - even constipation! It is what it is. If you understand this and accept this from deep inside your soul, if you expect no more from him, you will have less reason to upset yourself over his nuttyness.  Easier said than done, but wouldn't a little peace in your life feel good?Radical Acceptance: Embracing Your Life with the Heart of a Buddha
 by Tara Brach and Jack Kornfield.
Easier said than done. Consider too some professional help. Wishing you peace. Dr. Irene


Monday November 5, 2007Hi Doc;
Hi!I have remained very close to my verbally abused friend for 8 years. She continues to see a therapist who offers excellent advise. She continues to read about verbal abuse, control and emotional manipulation. She has said many times she is very close to leaving. She has seen an attorney. She has said she often gets sick to her stomach when she is with him. Ok...I feel her situation is very similar to an abduction described in papers and magazines I have read this year. The "invisible leash" keeps her abducted. In the October 20, 2003 (Answer 17) you questioned me about chasing a fantasy through her. Even though I love her very much I seem to be able to manage my own life better than 4 years ago. So this question is about helping her. *Sigh...*We have worked together 17 years for the same company. She receives bonuses and pay raises ever year. Everyone she works with respects her and values her knowledge. She is confident and very focused at work. She has said her job is her salvation and sanctuary. On Monday, when she described to me the typical weekend including all his insults about her looks, all the bad mother comments, and then he started describing how dumb she is and said, "You are so dumb, I am surprised you can keep your job". In the past, he would say she should find a better job. Usually, he repeats the same insults over and over and this was a new one.During the Monday work day, she felt so insecure when she received the typical expedite phone calls and pricing questions she has answered flawlessly for 17 years. I asked her how he could take her confidence at work away from her when he's not even here? She said it was part of all the other insults and she found herself believing everything he was saying. I said you know his "dumb" comments about your job are lies and, therefore, why not believe everything else he says are lies, too? I know it's not about "why". However, it sure is easy to fall into the "why" trap.I asked her again if she would agree to be interviewed by you for one hour. She was defensive and questioned whether you would offer other suggestions instead of the advise to just leave. If she's getting defensive, you are pushing her too hard. You can't want her to leave more than she wants to leave.What can you suggest to help my friend living a nightmare for 27 years? People stay in these relationships for different reasons. Clearly your friend is unhappy and is seeking help. But she has to be ready. Whatever that means to her, it is her life, and she needs to move in the direction she chooses, when and how and if she chooses. She should not move if she is not ready to. You can't do any more for her than you have already done. Wait. I stand corrected. You can. You can give her the space she needs to make up her own mind - and not push her as though you were living in her shoes. Yes, you would leave if you were she. But, you're not - and whatever her reasons, she is not. I can see how frustrating her situation is for you. But your frustration is the only thing you have any power to do anything about. I wonder how your frustration affects her? Are you creating a comfortable emotional space for her, or is she worried about your feelings too? Let it go. Please. Be empathetic and supportive, but stop trying to control what she does with her life. She's already got enough of that! Respect her enough to accept the decisions she makes for herself, and spend your energy dealing with your own frustration. I know this isn't what you wanted to hear, but you asked, and this is what I believe. Wishing you both well, Dr. Irene

Tuesday, November 6, 2007Dr. Irene:  I am in an unhappy 5 ½ year old marriage to a man whom I can best describe as self-centered, angry, and unwilling to seek help. 
:( We have two children 3 and 5.  I have in the meantime, based on your advice of 4 years ago, entered therapy with a wonderful therapist. Excellent! I have read The Verbally Abusive Relationship  and Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men  Excellent!  I have selected a divorce attorney, gone through and documented financial information, seen a few rental properties, created a budget to leave, etc.  Wow! I, however, find myself without immediate plans to leave.  I certainly would not say I love this man.  I am ecstatic and joyful when he is not home.  I am tense when I am around him.  I in fact pray for his absence.  I have been keeping a superficially nice and loving façade with him, hardly ever bringing up issues or mentioning any hurts or wrongs. This façade has kept me (maybe only on the surface) at peace, so that, when he is not home, I can actually be joyful and productive at my work. :) I'm glad you can find peace. I sometimes even believe my own little charade, and buy into the idea that I have a good marriage. Ooop! In the meantime, however, whenever we are overtly at odds, whenever I have had enough of his angry temper tantrums (truly out of the blue, including slamming doors, raising his voice, punching furniture in front of the children, etc), I do not talk to him, sometimes for months. I understand.During these times, I am depressed, have a feeling of dread, and cannot function well at work. Hmmm... It is as if the charade keeps me functioning, while the truth weakens me. Yea Why is that? You put yourself into protective denial. Here your wishful thinking about what is/may be keeps you afloat.Should it not be the reverse? It is the way it is - and the way it is is perfectly reasonable given your circumstances. You are OK when he is OK, but are miserable when he's awful - and your denial falls apart. The truth really does hurt. Does he actually strengthen me? Of course not. Only you can strengthen you. Do I have a dependency on him that is creating this type of superficial peace? Perhaps the best way to put it is that you likely are terrified of upsetting the status quo, breaking up the family, hurting the kids, the man who is their father, etc. You may also be afraid of going it alone, finances, career, etc. So, when he's OK, rather than deal with your frightful fears, you coast along by pushing the bad stuff away, half convinced it doesn't exist anymore. Do I need to go through this dread (and I mean it, it is a “dread”ful feeling of emptiness) to leave him? Sigh... Sorta. Face the fear and the fear will disappear. The more you avoid that which is feared, the more powerful you make it. But you're not ready to leave. I think you need to explore what frightens you first! Thanks for your insight on this one. You know, people stay in bad marriages for various reasons. Moral values, cultural heritage, family, children, religion, etc., may play a big role in choosing to leave or stay. Choosing to stay, if it is in line with your goals and values is not the worst thing in the world. The point is, choose what you want to do, and make that choice out of self-knowledge, not out of fear and avoidance.I am impressed with your ability to make yourself happy when he is not raging. You have developed the ability to disengage and direct your attention where you want it to be. Yay! This skill can be applied even when you are not deceiving yourself out of fear. Consider learning to disengage even further - so that you no longer allow the broken dream to destroy you when he does rage. At some level,  you probably think you need him. Learning to let him have his hissy fit while you walk away in disinterest would be an excellent lesson for the children. They learn how to be in life by watching the adults around them. (It goes without saying that you cannot and should not do this in a home situation where violence is or may be an issue.)
bulletWhat if you could disengage emotionally - and create your own joy as you do when his mood is OK - despite how icky he is? Wow!
bullet And what if you got a better handle regarding what your dread is about - why the need to deny the reality of your marriage? How much is your dread about opposing your family values, cultural values, religion, fear of upsetting others, looking bad, making waves, fear of going it alone, etc., etc.?
Accomplish these two objectives and you will be in a position to make a less dread-full, more clear-headed choice regarding what you want and what to do. There is no wrong choice, including staying, as long as it is the well thought out choice you make...Wishing you wisdom and joy, even when he's in a bad mood. Doc

January 19, 2008Dear Dr IreneI am a 19yr old male. My problem is my relationship with my mother. To be brief about 2 years ago I became depressed, enough to ask my mom for anti depressants which she agreed to, however I did not tell her why I was depressed only because I had difficulty doing so (for different reasons).The 3 years leading up to the point were a sort of quiet desperation, I spent all my time alone in my room. I was very much in a world of my own everybody including my family were outside that world my feelings were “I don’t need anybody”. :(   About the time my brother left for college it was just me and mom in the house she was asking everyday why I was depressed, I think I wanted to tell her, but as I said I had difficult for various reasons. One particular day I remember I came home from school early feeling very depressed I laid on the couch and she started to question I answered only in short grunts. She flipped and started kicking the chairs and accusing me of resenting her, her brother had died around that time and she told me “she couldn't deal with this”. Wow! No wonder you had such a difficult time telling her! You knew what the reaction would be like!I entered therapy and subsequently so did she although I'm not sure why. We were taking separate sessions although we took some sessions together also. I have left therapy now as I am past my depression. Yay! My mum told me she is leaving also, although her reason for leaving is because I am no longer going. “Nothing's changing, you still aren't talking to me so what's the point.” She frequently asks me “Are things ok with us.” In fact as I write this she asked me an hour ago. I said “yes”…. “then why wont you talk to me?”  I said because I want to be alone. She then became angry and told me I am avoiding her and resent her. *Sigh* Mum's got some problems... :(I have been feeling very guilty about the whole thing, I hate coming home at the weekends, I feel I have zero freedom to speak my mind since she becomes angry when I do. Sure. But what makes me feel guilty mostly is that she seems to accuse me of the same things I accuse her of. Lol! She told our therapist it's like waking on eggshells, that I am picker her up on things she says. That I am cold. (Yea, you are angry!) She told me that my isolation and rejection was a very cruel thing for me to do to her at a difficult time for her. But I was just doing what I was always doing, staying in my room. Sounds to me like you were reacting to a difficult mom and that she can't handle that. :(I'm very confused , I don’t know if I should feel guilty, hurt or angry. No "shoulds" here. You feel what you feel. Sounds like you have reason to feel what you feel too. I know I'd rather have nothing at all to do with her. I can understand that. But then I remember that is also cruel. We pick our friends, but we can't pick our families...To be honest I think I could say I hate her, and that causes me guilt too. I don’t even look at her in the eyes because I've never been able to keep that look of anger off my face, and she always notices that. I rarely get angry (although occasionally ill speak in a fed up tone) and I NEVER raise my voice but she does and says very cruel things sometimes :( but mostly she tells me how much I'm hurting her and leaves the room slamming doors, sometimes crying. Sounds like emotional manipulation to me. It's not your job to emotionally care for your mom, though she thinks it is. If at least I knew what I should be doing. Also, being honest, the thought of us becoming friends is very uncomfortable to me, but I don’t want her to be feeling bad as much as I don’t like her. I feel so drained , angry and guilty especially since she seems genuinely hurt. What should I do?We can't pick our families. From what you tell me, your mom has some serious problems (that have nothing to do with you), but that greatly affect you. You don't talk with her because you know if you do, you will get a reaction. Ouch! Plus, you are understandably furious with her for being unreasonable, yet you feel guilty because you hate how she feels angry or crushed when you are upset with her. Well, of course you're angry! Who wouldn't be! Well of course you feel guilty! You know she's doing the best she can!  All your feelings in reaction to your mom are purrfectly normal. Mom is no doubt doing the best she can, though she is not emotionally mature enough to be a good mom. Sounds like she wants you to be happy and takes an interest in your life, but can't handle it when you have a problem with her. Damned if you do and damned if you don't... You can't change your mom. Neither will therapy work on her given her attitude. I don't know one kid who doesn't wish their not-so-OK parent would change and become normal. But it unlikely that this will happen. What you can change is you. You can change your relationship with your mom in your head. This means you accept what is instead of secretly (or not so secretly) wishing she would become more OK. Consider writing her a letter telling her everything you want to say to her. But don't ever send it. Write the letter to help you clarify your own thoughts and feelings. Please go back to therapy, but keep mom out of it this time. Bring your therapist this Q & A; bring the letter you wrote mom. Sweetie, you can't fix your mom, but you can fix yourself so you're not in this tizzy just because your mom is not all there. Do this because if you don't, you risk being emotionally manipulated by people like mom throughout your life. It's just not worth it. If you came to terms with Mom emotionally, you would know that mom can be impossible at times and you would let her be that way without it eating you up; you would not be looking for her love or approval, you would be OK with whatever her feelings are and would not be manipulated by them; you would be OK with your feelings towards her. And you wouldn't spend too much time thinking about any of it because you would simply accept that this is how mom is. A good goal to work towards.  Wishing you wisdom and peace, Dr. Irene

Date: Monday January 21, 2008Time: 04:07 PM
   I was in an abusive marriage. My husband was hyper-critical of me and always trying to change me for the better. :(  I brought up the issues often and they were minimized and denied so that got nowhere for seven years. I got to the point where I was seriously thinking about leaving and told him so – he apologized and admitted his mistakes but it was followed with an expectation for me to instantly forgive and live in the future. More of the same, just hung on a different content hook. :(  I could not Of course not.  and this caused more issues of resentment Again, more of the same.  :(.  I shut down but I decided to stay for the benefit of keeping my family together. OK. I thought I would find a way to deal with it.  In his defense he did get a bit better, but I didn’t trust that it was real because he became financially dependent on me at the same time. No reason to trust; no track record of trust. Typically things get better for a while only to deteriorate since the issues underlying the misbehavior are not resolved. The victim's experience is often one of a lot of work for just a little gain. I thought he just didn’t want to rock the boat.  His abuse would still rear its ugly head often enough to let me know it was still there or enough to not let me forget it. *Sigh* Exactly. My way of dealing with it was to become passive aggressive and have affairs.  I finally realized that this was twisted and destructive and stopped.  Now I not only had his abusive behavior to deal with but also my reaction to it.  Yes...  I left him 10 months ago because I just couldn’t take it anymore.  There was a “deal breaker” that gave me the propulsion to leave.  OK.  Since he has promised to change and admitted his wrongs Again? (of course this happens after I leave Of course.) but I can’t bring myself to give him a chance. Too little too late. Sounds like you've already given him many chances.  Sometimes there is just too much water under the bridge... I got into a great, healthy and nurturing relationship right after I left. Good for you! But be careful, sometimes you don't know what the relationship will be like until you are "his." This relationship has shown me what a good relationship can be.  I have been unwilling to sacrifice this new relationship to give my marriage another chance and have guilt over that because I’m tearing apart a family. I can understand that. I’m beating myself up constantly. Oh my! I guess in the end I brought my own issues to the table in the dysfunctional ways I dealt with the abuse and that I should possibly give it one more shot.  Honestly, even if you were able to bring yourself to go back, can you go back with all your heart? Or would you only be going through the motions? But I can’t find it in me and feel horrible guilt. Understandable. I need support. Yes! Been to The CatBox? I can’t imagine anything but being miserable if I return, yet I keep thinking about it, but can’t do it.  I’m in a personal hell right now all as a result of his issues. Oh dear, think what kind of emotional Hell your husband would be in if he was as sensitive to his destructive tendencies as are you to yours -  years of past misdeeds! Oh, and, why would one more chance change anything? How many chances have you given him already? You feel guilty because you compromised your very solid values (love of family, etc.). And now you are stuck in the pain of the violation against Self. Hasn't enough damage been done? Between the multitude of sins on your husband's part, and your retaliation... Isn't this more than one family's share? Your stuckendess in guilt only adds insult to injury. Will your pain erase the past and restore the family? Will it make anything better? If it was your good friend who was stuck in this guilt instead of yourself, how would you advise this person? Would you be so hard on them? Would you have them burn in Hell? Are you being too hard on yourself?I hear that you want to move on, but, understandably, I also get that you also want to get rid of the pain. You can't do that.  It just doesn't work. Your pain and that which you hold dear, are flip sides of the same coin. Throw one out, and you've tossed the other. Move forward, yes. But face your pain and move forward, both at the same time. Slow down on committing to the new relationship. Even if this relationship is the "right" choice, walking into it without dealing with the guilt may backfire down the road. The risk of using the relationship to mitigate the guilt is too high. Don't risk tainting what may be good and pure with future misgivings. Enter with a clearer heart.  Take a little time and get some help with this.  A therapist might be a smart move. Dr. IreneSaturday January 26, 2008
11:00 PM
Dr. Irene, I was married 18 years. 8 years ago, I realized I was constantly giving to a man with no empathy or ability to communicate or value me. His abuse was covert, silent, withholding. I brought up the behaviors I felt were unkind and asked him for change. He diverted, withheld, blocked, denied, and ignored. He insinuated there was "something wrong with me;" I was always "too sensitive." I went to counseling and gained respect for myself and I stood up to him.
Yay! I became angry because I was ignored and devalued for my strength and self esteem. Yes. On October 4th 2006 he said he needed time "to think" and by December 31 he was gone. Good riddance. He never said he wanted a divorce, just "time" to think. He promised to date me, talk on email, not have sex nor date others because he did not want our marriage to be over, and a separation would help us. He only took clothes because he did not think he would be gone long. Then he never spoke to me again in person. Ugh.The few emails we exchanged blamed me for “pushing him away.” I found out he was sleeping with his business partner. He cleaned out both business and personal accounts, changed the locks on our business. He did everything through lawyers, claiming he did not want to talk to me because he claimed "I was abusive." ????? You were probably angry, and with good reason. I was traumatized....I WAS ABUSIVE??? I think you were married to someone with big problems. You were not the controlling person; he was. Abuse is about control. So, something is wrong with you, you are too sensitive, you and too this and too that... I had no idea how I was going to provide for my kids. Any emotion I expressed he claimed was considered "abusive" by him. :( I was the victim you talk about that looks like the abuser because they get so freaked out from confusion and frustration. Yes. I read about narcissists and it describes him perfectly. His mother agrees he is one. I read about victims and it describes me. I admit I turned things around, for self-preservation. He just would not hear that he did anything wrong. He was always right. My question is, does an abuser leave? Well, yours did! Sure abusers leave. Usually the victim leaves them, but abusers also leave. Especially when they find another love interest. My guess is that had things not worked out between them, he would have returned. Notice: he asked for time - just in case she didn't work out. Narcissists especially transfer partners like the objects they view them as.Or am I the real abuser? I often believe everything is my fault, but my gut tells me no. The real abuser rarely asks themselves that question. The codependent is very good at asking that question. The codependent takes too much responsibility; the abuser too little. The codependent doesn't trust their gut; the abuser rarely questions it. I was unhappy but believed it could be the way it was in the beginning again "someday." Lol! Sounds like the wishful thinking of the codependent. :) Little things would happen that made me think change was "just around the corner." Your site assumes the victim leaves. Should I assume I AM the abuser, like he claims? No! Listen to your body. Stop listening to him! If you look throughout my site, you will also find articles on how the victim often thinks they are the abuser because they are told they are and because they second guess themselves. You see yourself having an angry outburst and that qualifies you as abuser? I don't think so. If you must accuse yourself of something, try accusing yourself of wishful thinking or naivetee.I am confused. I learned once a narcissist realizes he can't control his victim he sees their confidence and boundaries as abuse and throws them away. Is this what happened? That's what it looks like to me. Does the fact that HE left ME, mean I am an abuser too? Unlikely. I am flourishing and I am finding things he devalued in me are the very things that are best about me. I love my life, and am grateful I get to live a real life now. Thanks for your site, I read it a lot to help remind me of what I lived with for 18 years and what I no longer must deal with. I appreciate any insight you might have. Confused, VH Well, obviously I can't diagnose anybody I haven't met, but you have said absolutely nothing that is not consistent with victimhood, including your anger. And you have said nothing about him that is not consistent with the narcissistic individual, including covering his bases. Given the confusion you've felt over this, consider treatment again. You need to learn to trust yourself more. A lot more. Cyber Hugs, Dr. Irene 


Monday February 18, 2008
06:46 PM
Dear Dr. Irene, My husband of 30 years went into therapy at my suggestion, approx. a year ago because of grief from his mothers death, anger and resentment from his career problems etc. I perceived him as being in the midst of a "mid-life crisis," and was so relieved that he was finally going to face these problems. He did a stealth 180, and to make a long and hideously painful story short, he ended up not discussing his problems (yesterday, he told me that they haven't gotten to that yet!!) telling me it was HIS DECISION to divorce (almost as if he were proud of his "courage"), saying he didn't love me anymore, I was an emotional and psychological burden - I think you probably are getting the picture. In short, its what every stay at home mom and wife of 30 years longs to hear.
I'm sorry. :(  One of my many many questions is - how is it possible for my husband to go into therapy as someone I trusted and loved and emerge a flaming heartless narcissist? One doesn't just turn into a narcissist. But it may be he felt his life with your family was a compromise of sorts for a long time. He told me it was my fault Your fault? He's not taking responsibility! because our marriage caused him too much pain etc. more than he was "willing to accept." When he talked to me I felt like he was "channeling" his therapist. I am so angry that my children and I the ones that are the collateral damage from his "therapy."  What kind of therapy IS this? Geez, I have no idea... As a result of this I am in therapy now trying to make sense of this disaster and it is helping me regain my "sanity." Good! I also left him six months ago, but still struggle with an "Alice in Wonderland" type of disorientation from time to time, but its getting better. Understandable. It is so creepy when I do talk to him, he seems vacant and emotionless - clueless as to what he's done and lost, our marriage, his relationship with his children. Any light you could shine on this tragic situation would be greatly appreciated.  Not much light because I don't know anything about your husband. But I do know that when two people go into individual therapy, sometimes it pulls them apart. It may be that your husband truly was not not happy in your marriage, but didn't understand that. Sometimes the issues surrounding divorce are so difficult to consider (money issues, change, etc.), people "prefer" denial. They just don't want to deal with it.  The "midlife crisis" is what happens when an individual, who has never looked at his or her life, can no longer not see, and makes a radical shift, often during a time of crisis. His mother's death may have set him off.In therapy people talk about themselves; what they want; where they want to go. it doesn't really matter that he didn't talk about what you mean about his problems, because whether he was telling the therapist what he wanted to therapist to hear or not, he took his life in the direction of his choice, right or wrong.For whatever reason, your husband decided to give up what he had and start elsewhere. When you say that he was almost "courageous" in telling you he was done, it suggests that for a long time he stayed despite not being happy. Perhaps he stayed for the sake of the family, for the children, etc. Perhaps he finally got the courage to leave. Leaving may or may not be the "correct" choice for him.He may truly be onto something right for him, or he may be running away from or acting out his stuff; hard to tell. He  may be exploring who he is, especially if he never followed his internal messengers before.  It is sad that he blames you for his misery (since he creates his own misery), and sadder yet that he didn't take the time to help you understand what was going on with him by, for example, bringing you into a few of his sessions.Whatever it is, it is. Clearly you're having a difficult time adjusting, and who can blame you? It was not your decision to end the marriage. Perhaps he will make a better attempt to help you understand down the road; perhaps not. In any case, whenever God closes a door, He opens a window. I'm glad you're in therapy trying to make sense of things and get your bearings. You may find that you can create a life for yourself that you never thought possible. You may like it. :).Wishing you well, and sending warm wishes. Dr. Irene


Saturday March 08, 2008
04:17 PM
Like Dana in your article entitled
The Female Narcissist, February 16, 2002, my estranged wife Marisol is a real charmer—and all the rest as well. Like Dana, this very beautiful, very charming (and extremely manipulative) young woman has absolutely no concern for others apart from those who are in a position to provide her with narcissistic supplies. Under duress, I reluctantly married Marisol, a foreigner, in a civil ceremony in May 2001. Marisol married me for immigration benefits and stayed with me until I had nothing more to give—financially or emotionally. Six months after she abandoned me, after careful consideration, I filed a complaint for annulment of the marriage alleging immigration marriage fraud. In order to prevail, I need to prove fraud in the inception. Obviously, proving what another person intended—what was in her mind when she repeated her marriage vows—is difficult. However, I wonder whether or not expert testimony regarding BPD and/or NPD might help to establish her propensity to use, abuse, and deceive others, which would, for the purposes of Canon Law, render her incapable of entering into a valid marriage. I hope to use the teachings of the Catholic Church on marriage and annulment to establish her state of mind at the time she entered into the civil marriage. What are your thoughts? How might I establish BPD and/or NPD to the satisfaction of the court? Have you ever testified as an expert witness? Do you know anyone who has? What advice can you offer me?  *Sigh* I think you need a very, very good attorney and possibly the advice of a good forensic psychologist. I'm going to refund your payment since I have no answers for you. Wish I could help. Good luck to you. Dr. Irene


Wednesday March 12, 2008
11:06 AM
I finally left my verbally/emotionally abusive boyfriend of 8 months 2 wks ago.
Good for you! It started happening badly, to where I would cut myself after. Four months ago after I cheated. But before then, he would put me down for my exes and my hobbies occasionally, which is why I cheated and wanted to end it but couldn't.  :( After breaking up, he was so apologetic, depressed, sad & "I love you, I want to marry you" that I gave him my time and listened, and somehow believed he realized what he did and would change. I didn't want to go back, I just hated that I had caused someone so much pain in their life. I didn't have the courage to say NO. Now that I did go back, I lost somebody else (an ex) I believe I truly loved (that I promised I would not go back to the abuser) because they found out we had spoken. I feel lost and a "loser" in all senses. Like I am a weak, terrible, lonely person. Hold on here! I keep messing up. I get my bio B.S. in May. Yay! Conratulations! This has only made me feel worse after the abuse. Awww... Of course you feel awful given what you've been through, but please take pride in your accomplishment! A worthwhile accomplishment that will benefit you throughout life.  I am struggling to find strength and happiness again, and recover from the heartbreak and abuse. Hmmm.... I see that, and I agree you need to find your strength and to recover. But I don't think your problem is about "relationships," or even about the abusive relationship you've just left. I think first you need to deal with your most important relationship: the relationship with yourself!Please take some time for the Self. Away from love relationships. Learn first to have a more loving relationship with you. This is very, very important, and the basis of any successful love relationship.  You are not a "loser," but an individual who needs to find herSelf. You are not a "weak, terrible, lonely person." You are a bright and sensitive young woman who is looking for happiness in all the wrong places, places outside the Self. I can promise that you won't find what you're looking for there, at least not permanently. Do yourSelf a BIG favor. Find a therapist you feel comfortable with and stick with them. Since you mention cutting and feeling lost, I strongly suggest you find a DBT (Dialectic Behavior Therapy) therapist because a DBT practitioner is in the best position to help you learn the skills you need to not just get through life, but to help you thrive; to grow. To become comfortable inside your own skin. You are worth it. Promise. Wishing you the very best, Dr. Irene

Wednesday August 27, 2008
02:33 PM
Hi Dr. Irene- I've posted a question before. Thank you for the good information!
You are welcome. :)After about 6 years of marriage I am finally coming to face the fact that my husband is verbally abusive. I'm seeing a counselor who identified it immediately and recommended The Verbally Abusive Relationship . Little did she know that she passed the test! I read your advice about being careful to find a counselor who had experience in this area. Lol! Anyway, I am having a hard time disengaging  Disengaging...Yes, that is the key word :) from the arguments with my husband. I had planned to go back to school, a plan that would take me five years to complete. I am so exhausted by being on edge and under so much tension that I decided to return to work instead. :(I have been a stay at home mom for the last 4 years. Every time I bring up finding childcare my husband has a million different reasons why it is a bad idea. OK, but the choice should be your choice. In a normal (i.e., not controlling) marriage, you would balance your needs and the family's needs, and your husband supports your choices - simply because your choices are important to you. (And, of course, I am assuming you are not making those choices out of anger/rebellion. I don't think you are,  but since many people are reading this, I need to make that clear.)I confronted him about this. Back to the wonderful "D" Word: Disengage. If you're emotionally disengaged from his stuff, there is nothing to confront. You know he doesn't have to agree with you and that you don't need his "permission." And, given your history together, you know that he will most likely not support your choices, so you don't expect to have a mutual conversation. You make your choice and simply give him the courtesy of telling him what you will do. You don't get into exchanges about it, or defend the validity of your position. You don't even get caught up in the "But you are my wife and this has to be a mutual decision" bait because you are dealing with an individual who has a history of controlling you. Nor do you say that you are making a unilateral decision because he's controlling, because then you'll be baited into arguing that one! So, no explaining, no defending, just a statement. He will get mad and you will do nothing. Let it blow over. Needless to say, you don't do this if your marriage is physically abusive.I told him that I felt it was unfair that I had to be the one to find the right daycare that he would approve of. We never agreed that I would stay home permanently but that is how he is treating it. If you are disengaged, none of this matters. Unless you don't have access to the bank account (which you should demand if you don't have) or unless your marriage is physically abusive, you don't need his permission or his approval. Your opinion is as right for you as his opinion is right for him.  Anyway, when I expressed this he turned it around on me saying that I kept changing my mind about school and that he didn't feel like work was a good enough reason to put our children in daycare. No problem. That's his opinion. But since you are the one taking care of the kids, your say counts more. There is nothing to argue and he can talk to the air as much as he wants. After I found myself defending my position I realized that he escaped dealing with my complaint! Yep. That's what happens when you ask permission instead of state your thoughts.  The hardest part about accepting this is letting go of the idea that I could communicate effectively with this man. Well, I would disagree. You certainly can communicate, but you are unlikely to get him to see things your way. So don't even try. The good news is that unless you are in a physically abusive or otherwise threatening marriage, you don't have to! Anyway, my real question is " Am I getting ahead of myself by trying to make these big decisions without enough support and thought."  I think its sad that your husband is more interested in having you do things his way than in having you grow in the direction you choose. I think its double sad that as a result, and because you care too much, you find yourself in a position where you are second guessing yourself. Ask yourself instead, "What is it with my "need" to have his support to do what I want to do? Especially when I can count on not getting it.!You won't be able to do this now. Work on detaching in counseling, Work on what to do with the guilt, the anger, the second-guessing that will arise as you move towards emotional independence. This is a suggested direction that will move you away from the subservient spot you are in now. The Secret of Overcoming Verbal Abuse: Getting Off the Emotional Roller Coaster and Regaining Control of Your Life by Albert Ellis et al. is highly recommended reading for you.I don't want my children to get caught in the middle of my anger and his abuse. They won't if you're not caught up with it!   Good luck to you! Doc

Friday September 12, 2008
12:12 PM

Hi Dr. Irene: Hi! I have a boyfriend who I have been seeing for almost a year. He is very sweet, accommodating and thoughtful in every day life and we are quite affectionate and compatible. He does not show controlling behavior in every day life, he is pretty egalitarian, complimentary. He can be very playful and fun as well. I am attracted to him in a number of ways, and he to me. He has from early on talked about marriage and now we are on the verge of picking out rings etc...

The Other Shoe: Four or five times now we have gotten into a really heated argument. During these times he seems to become another person. He tantrums rather than argues and accuses me throughout the argument. For example, he says that I am showing signs I do not want to get married because I have not picked out a ring (we visited the ring shop last week and by the way he has not formally asked me yet) and I haven't moved out of my apartment yet although I have said I am not quite ready (again he has not asked me yet). OK, you're bringing up that you want the proposal first twice. Did you tell him that that? He may think its OK to do that after the ring is purchased, etc. But in fact I have changed my rental agreement because of the potential to move in when engaged. As this cost me money, I said it's a pretty clear sign of my commitment. He responds irrationally to those comments. He also says I do not want to hang out with any of his friends and when I say: 'You haven't asked me out with any of them' he ignores this and keeps ranting. Implement a little golden rule now: Never talk about anything with each other when either person is angry. It will just get you into trubble. By the way, this is something virtually every marital counselor will agree with!

He also got mad because he is in a small way helping me with a real estate situation with a former boyfriend which is very frustrating. I have asked him repeatedly if this bothers him, and he insists it does not. Yet when I point out he told me it was okay, he said I should have known even though he was telling me the opposite of what he was feeling. No, you shouldn't have known. Tell him that. Tell him too that you appreciate his wanting to help despite his difficult feelings, but that you'd rather he be honest with you and not help you if whatever it is bothers him. He'll just come to resent you for it in the end. Anyway, when he is in this state he can not be talked out of it Don't even try! Agree ahead of time that you will calmly exit when you see him too worked up and several times he has escalated to telling me to leave, its over. He is very cold during this time.  Bad sign. The next day at some point he has always recanted and says when in his right mind that he never meant any of the things he said about me. Boyfriend needs to learn how to shut his mouth when he's angry! Tell him! One time he criticized my cleaning but then later said that never bothers him. He is really irrational when arguing and it always feels like I can't win, that he is not actually trying to solve the problem, but to inflate it. That is not a good sign. See if he can agree to the no talking when upset "rule." See what happens. Oddly there have been a few times when he was actually wonderful in a argument when I was upset so I don't know. I did leave one time after one of the bad episodes for a week and he did agree to go to counseling which he is going to every week and seems to be getting something out of it.

Can controlling and abusive guys have this profile? Sure they can. Or not! It throws me because he really is not so 95 percent of the time. Most abusive guys are great 95% of the time, especially early on. It goes downhill from there with held resentments tightly held and blame. His shortcomings become your fault. But there is not enough here to label your man.

Which doesn't mean an abusive pattern won't eventually develop once he "has" you and/or life stresses him too much.

On the other hand, he may simply be a bit of a hothead who is working too hard at trying to please and needs to learn to relax - and shut his big mouth and think before he talks.

Is he abusive? I don't know. There is some bothersome stuff here, but this could be present in a young guy without abuse issues as well. You may pick up some more clues by looking into his family background as well as your own. Any abuse? Look too at past romantic relationships. Any abuse? We tend to repeat our unresolved stuff.

Angry talk is not necessarily about abuse. Control is. Is the power in the relationship balanced, or does he have more say than you? Does what he think, say, want, etc. more important that what you think, say, want, etc? "Winning" is suggestive because winning can be a control tactic. Lies, half truths or misleading statements and other manipulations are suggestive. Insecurity is suggestive. Not supporting you in whatever it is you want is suggestive because that is usually about control. "Remaking" you is suggestive as changing you is about control if it persists beyond the good things each of us can teach those close to us. Knowing you better than you know yourself/ knowing what's best for you better than you know for yourself is highly suggestive; that is about control. 

Look not only at the presence or absence of abuse stuff, but also at the intensity. A little bit of anything is generally OK.

Good for him for entering counseling! Furthermore, I suggest you go with him for a bit. It may be a good place to examine your concerns (perhaps print out this Q&A) in a supportive atmosphere where you are more likely to enter into a constructive exchange. 

Most important, keep your eyes open and listen to your body. If something inside is pulling at you (and it must be for you to ask these questions), don't ignore it. There is no rush. Take your time; this is your life!

Good luck to you both! Dr. Irene


Sunday September 28, 2008
11:15 AM

Hi, I've just now come to fully realize that I am and have been an emotionally abusive husband and father. I have criticized all of my wife's self esteem down to nothing. It has trickled through her to my 11 year old daughter, who lacks confidence and self worth. My wife's comparison of me with my mother was what opened my eyes fully, as she too always has an endless supply of little one line criticisms or head shaking or just a sigh. It's no mystery where I got it.  Yes, kids learn not from what their parents say, but what their parents do.

See, I was asking her not use put-downs to discipline our child, as it reduced self esteem. She told me I had done to her for years the same thing, with terrible damage to her psyche! Acting like my mother, whom I have a close, long distance, relationship with, though don't get along with well in person.

The blood ran to my feet and I knew that she was right. I feel terrible, as I should, and I want to make it up to them. When I stop this When you choose to..., as I must, will time alone fix us? I think before time can heal, you have to stop acting out... How to avoid criticizing about criticizing ? How can I make amends ? Ask her; but don't ask until you've gotten a handle on your behavior.

My wife has never been very open about her feelings as opposed to myself, who wants it all out on the table to be talked over until resolved. When you force her to talk when she doesn't want to, you are hurting her. Never talk until BOTH people want to. She held it in as it ate at her, and my heart is breaking for her, and I love her and want to make it up to her. I'm so afraid of losing her.

Probably the most important thing to keep in mind as a short term solution you can start right NOW is that behavior and feelings/thoughts are very different. Behavior is external. Thoughts and feelings are internal. Yes, you will have to clean up the internal stuff, but meanwhile, you can stop putting what you think and feel "out there." You don't have to "act" the way you feel.

Feel angry? Misunderstood? In need of resolution? Whatever... Do nothing. Say nothing.

Journal it instead. Find a therapist and bring your journals with you. You will need help with this. Doing this will help you gain control over your impulses, which seem to get you into trouble. So, for now, live with all the nagging frustration/etc. I'm certain you have. But simply holding that frustration, pain, and anger is a better plan than letting it out into the world in any way (which includes speech, letters you send, gestures, facial expressions, etc. Just Hold it, Journal it. Don't act it out in the world, and certainly don't drink it away or find other other distractions to mask it.

There is a wonderful little book to help you with anger. ACT on Life, Not on Anger  by Eifert, McKay, Forsyth, and Forsyth. That should get you started, at least until you can find yourself some help. Let your poor wife be for now; worry about beginning the road to fixing you, and let things take their course from there.

Wishing you well on this wonderful journey...

Doc

October 13, 2008

I am a 51 year old woman, no children, and my recent ex is 56. I was married for ten years early on to a normal man whom I divorced craving excitement?, and ever since I've mostly ended up with men who have serious issues. As background I grew up with a mother who was and is psychologically abusive to me and a successful but alcoholic father. My father never verbally abused me but I watched him verbally abuse my oldest brother for years. I would get stomach aches from the tension when it happened, and was always watching to see what mood my father was in. Growing up having to watch out for the adults around you tends to produce a codependent adult. You are essentially trained to watch out for and anticipate others, instead of growing up care-free…

 I fell in love with a diagnosed sociopath/borderline after I divorced. He was so charming but of course it turned into something horrible. My next boyfriend was an attractive man who told me he had been diagnosed with a character disorder but in my early thirties I didn't know what that meant and I didn't ask him which one. I'm not diagnosing him, but he was a bit sadistic and more than a little narcissistic. He was wonderful at first too. I barely dragged myself out of that relationship I had so little self-esteem at the end, but I was the one who ended it. Good for you!

 After a few years I had another really bad relationship with a man who was wonderful in the beginning, but ended up verbally would castigate me for tiny things. Unfortunately that’s how it starts. Most are great early on. His estranged daughter suddenly died while he and I were together and he said that he was ok about it, as he had been over her years ago! I found out he had no empathy for other humans. He understood humans, as he was a psychologist who worked well with patients weirdly enough, but he didn't care about them. He also literally told me after we broke up that he wanted to get inside the skin of a woman and take over. After that relationship I would tremble when I walked out in public. I felt destroyed. Then I spent three years building myself up, becoming strong and centered in myself, running my business, staying away from relationships. Good move.

 Now I'm grieving my recently ended 3 ½ year relationship with a man from whom I received checkered treatment, both wonderful and scary. He was terribly abused as a child, is a recovered alcoholic with DV incidents during his  20's and 30's, turned his life around and became well-respected by others and is a decent human being but has some control issues. I broke up with him because my requirements of how I want to be treated are higher now. Good! Insisting on good treatment is a good way to get it - usually.

I know when something is not right, and what I'm responsible for and what I'm not. But I spent so long in a tug of war with myself, knowing what the truth was but wanting to stay for the good parts. You know you’re not alone on this one. Many of us do the same thing… I knew something was up in the first 6 months, but I was so desperate for the emotional support and love and help I got 90% of the time, that I stayed until recently. He wasn't the worst man I've been with, but I can't take anyone raging at me anymore. Anger yes. Scary rage, no. Well said!

 I felt like I did with my father, watching for what mood he was in. I hear you. At the end he tried that trick of accusing me of being the same as he is. I just calmly said, no, I'm not like you. I have my own faults but raging at you is not one of them. You sound relatively centered. Good!

 He is intensely focused on his own feelings about things when he needs to focus more on the external reality of a situation and less on how it makes him feel, as how things make him feel is an accordion of perceptions from years past, and I am not responsible for them. Nor am I responsible for shoring up his fragile, brittle self, except to treat him with compassion, dignity, and love, which I did. Right. Only he can be responsible for his own feelings.

 I briefly went to two different therapists during our relationship, and also group sessions at my local women's shelter. The therapists thought I was overreacting and poo poo'd my concerns about this man, even the one who used to work as a DV counselor. The shelter counselor said he was an abuser. OK. I just know that the knot in the middle of my chest is now gone, and I am much more relaxed. The body is telling you something. J

 I have the reputation of being independent, strong, self-sufficient. I can tolerate being alone, yet my personal relationships always end up with me caught up with these types of men. I can remember every time I would get that "uh-oh" feeling that something wasn't right. We have a problem. I know the truth when the moment happens, but then I twist it around in my mind and seemingly deliberately enter into the Alice in Wonderland world of these men. How can I stop doing this? I know my own worth, I really do. I just wish I knew why at that important moment when I'm confronted with an unhealthy man who may psychically harm me, I push the override button and carry on with him, and shove my worth into the back seat. The good news is that you are very clear on your weakness. You know. But your dependency needs and wishful thinking seem to get in your way. Have you read When Hope Can Kill: Reclaiming Your Soul in a Romantic Relationship by Lucy Papillon? 

 Right at this moment I want my boyfriend back. And I want a giant decadent fudge cake with ice cream, whipped cream and chocolate shavings. But I also want to fit into last winter’s pants. *sigh* Get the point? I contacted him to talk about making our relationship permanent, as the last time I saw him it was up in the air and I had a decision to make, and in that few weeks time he's gone from dying for me to marry him, to having a new love of his life of one month's duration and he has no use for me anymore. Instead of feeling relieved that this other woman is saving me from making a mistake, I want him back even more. What's wrong with me that I want this in my life? Your dependency needs are getting the best of you. I wonder too if you’re not a little depressed. Talk to your doc about a mild antidepressant to get you through this, or consider speaking with him/her about St. John’s wort.

 It is OK to miss him. Feel the pain of missing him for a few moments and then gently put your mind elsewhere. It’s important to understand the difference between feeling the pain each time something reminds you of it, and wallowing in it – that is the pain we can talk ourselves into, create ourselves. (That’s why the antidepressant is very helpful during times like this. )

You can learn to consciously focus your mind on more productive things. (Like using this time to be the best you that you can be! Learn a language, get physically fitter, redo your hair, start a new hobby, whatever  – and commit to and do the things you’ve picked out whether you feel like it or not!)

You can learn this excellent and effective mindfulness technique by studying and practicing the exercises in this book: Wherever You Go, There You Are : Mindfulness Meditation in Everyday Life by Jon Kabat-Zinn.   Your peace of mind is inside of you, unless you unwittingly choose to give in to your “natural” feelings and forfeit it. It seems to me that you are mature enough, self-aware enough, and persistent enough (and you know what I mean by that! J) to gain particular benefit from learning to practice mindfulness. It helps you better develop self control over where you choose to go mentally and emotionally.

Another thing many find helpful is to sit down and write a bulleted list of all the junk he’s ever done to you and how it is felt. Refer to it during those weak moments. Keep a copy by the phone, on the refrigerator, in your wallet. It’s much easier to write the list when you are angry, but do your best.

 The bottom line is that only YOU can choose where you want to go. The easiest road is usually not the most productive one. Where do you want to go? Are you willing to make a commitment to yourself to move in that direction?

 More to consider: Sounds like your body hasn’t lied to you yet. Consider a commitment to exit at the first tummy knot next time. Better yet, consider a commitment to understand how it is that you are susceptible to the great early-on treatment. It’s the same ol’ dependency wants playing their tricks - because it’s what you know. It is familiar. BTW, dependency “wants” is so much more accurate than dependency “needs” – you need water, food, and air to live. You want this. But do you really? You’re never too old to learn new tricks.

 Good luck to you and God bless. Doc


Sunday November 30, 2008
04:52 AM

At 30 I really feel like my sister took all of my 20's with emotional abuse. Controlling, smothering, vindictive would all describe the behavior. I have in the past 6 years been dealing with this realization. So, to begin my process of healing, I moved away from my family into a home alone this year. My older sister promptly moved in with me with encouragement from my parents and I didn't know how to stop it. You couldn't just say, "No, I want to live alone" ?The whole thing was ironic considering one month earlier I was told by her that I deserved all the pain I had on my job because I refused to listen longer than the 5 hours I already had about a man she liked that didn't like her.

 My parents were appalled, but not enough to tell her so. Hmmm. She get soooo incensed, people don't want to set her off? One month after moving in with me she found "the love of her life". I was immediately ignored and pushed to the side. All she did was flaunt this relationship in my face. I haven't had a date, ever. Despite this I did everything humanly possible to be supportive, but eventually had to tell her to move out. Good for you! I could no longer take being taken advantage of and ignored.

 My parents also backed her behavior up once again. Instead of telling her the truth. Which is, if you are going to be actively dating someone as an adult, you should go to your own home.  And she shouldn't flaunt her relationship around your single sister on purpose. Well, I'm not sure I agree with that. Her behavior may have been insensitive,  but its not her job to protect you from your jealous feelings. Unless, of course, she had her boyfriend over all the time, sleep-overs, etc that would interfere with your home life. I am now feeling resentment, anger and sadness. She is now getting married and I feel like a loser. I think you're being awfully hard on yourself. :(  I feel dumped in a sense. You don't sound like you really wanted her around in the first place, but I can certainly understand how you could be upset; good stuff seems to happen to her, and not to you. And she's doesn't even seem very considerate!

I gave up years trying to get along with someone who wasn't doing the same. I forfeited finding a husband for myself. You're only 30, so it's OK. But don't give up any more of your precious time! Too busy trying to get along with the family and being told she had a more pressing need to get married due to age and that made me feel less important. Are my feelings valid? What has happened here? How do I move on?

Of course your feelings are valid! They are your feelings! They are talking to you! You count! Listen to them!

You sacrificed your comfort and convenience for your family's and sister's sake, only to have her move on at her convenience. You waited for the family to scold her, and they didn't. Well, of course you feel sad, resentful, and angry!

There's a lesson here: While you don't have to be inconsiderate in the process, you need to learn how to take care of yourself first, before you try to accommodate other people's needs. Certainly, you can learn to speak up for yourself. It's not up to your parents to say the words you want to say. You can do it much better.

It is OK to move into your own place, and insist that it remain your own place.  It's OK to say to your sister that you find it sad that thinks that you deserve the pain you have at work. It's OK to tell your family that while you love and support them, that you have your own life to live.

Think about taking charge of your own life - instead of living it to seek other people's approval, love, company, or whatever it is that motivates you. I don't think you understand how you very unintentionally create your pain when you sacrifice, but you do. Of course you're resentful, sad, and angry! Your feelings are telling you that you're not getting what you want out of life!

Listen to these feelings. They are telling you that you need to change course and actively pursue what it is that you seek and value.

Therapy would be an excellent option for you. Please give this option serious consideration. You may be very glad you did.  Dr. Irene

Wednesday January 14, 2009
09:27 AM

Been divorced from Ex-husband for 10 years. We divorced after 5 rocky years when our son was 1 year old. We have joint custody. I divorced him because he’s a psychopath. Ex re-married & divorced shortly after. Ex used to & continues to put me and my family down via guilt, sarcasm, blaming criticism. He certainly does have a problem... to say the least.

I’ve been happily remarried for 8 years with 7 year old daughter & stepdaughter. Mostly I ignore exes malicious & provoking comments. Good. Because he wants you to guy into it and react.

This week it exploded & my 13 year old son is in the middle. Ex-husband made son feel guilty in order to get what he wanted at the expense of my family. My son & stepdaughter are really close & ex-husband minimizes it telling him that my marriage is in shambles & when we divorce he’ll never see step-sister again. No matter what I say he turns it around and uses it against me. He also has fictional ideas about the state of my marriage & finances that he uses to validate his own point to my son.

I have never badmouthed my ex-husband but I need to help my son handle this kind of personality. Just be honest!  Speaking the truth is not badmouthing! Covering up by saying nothing to your son about what his father is doing enables the father to brain wash him!  My son heard my ex screaming numerous explatives to me & is intimidated by him. I want to empower my son in a respectful way. I don’t know if that’s possible. My son is sweet, I don’t want him to be a bully or be bullied by his dad. Empower your son by modeling healthy behavior. For example, while your ex screams and curses, walk away and calmly say that you will talk with him when he is willing to talk and not scream and swear. Let your son see you deal with this man.

Have a good heart to heart with your boy. Explain to him everything you see his father doing and why. Explain why you never contested the father's behavior, i.e., you did not want to "badmouth." Tell him you never realized that presenting the truth is not badmouthing. Tell him what his father does and why you left him as it pertains to the situation.

If you don't explain the entire story to your kid, in a way he can understand it at his age, he has only his father's distorted version to go by.

Badmouthing is about cursing and blasting and blaming. The truth is simply that. The truth as you see it, which includes your frustration at the father's antics and your inability to stop it. And includes your frustration at watching your son be manipulated. It also includes a statement of fact regarding your marriage and his step sister.

My husband is not like this and I know my ex tells my son that’s weakness. Tell your son there is no strength in bullying. What do I say to my son? The truth. How often?  Whenever he asks or you see something going on. What are key things to lookout for or point out to my son? All of the above. Stop treating him like he can't handle the truth. At some level, he probably knows. Validate his reality; help correct it if he is too brainwashed. I don’t want him to be at war or walking on eggshells every time he goes to his dad’s.  Exactly! Good luck! Doc


Wednesday January 21, 2009
11:10 AM

I just left a emotionally abusive relationship. I had been seeing this man for about 8 months. The first week that I moved in, he changed. The man I thought I knew was kind, giving, on the quiet and shy side but it was a quality I adored. Never did I ever see what was to come. All of a sudden, I was being told glasses were put in the wrong place and started withdrawing affection from me when he was upset. If we had a discussion about something and I didn't agree, then I would get the silent treatment for days. If I dressed up or look nice for something, he would never compliment me or say a word. He said he would be "processing" the argument and needed his time. Emotional manipulation and control.

I say he was withholding to punish me. Sounds right, though I'm sure he saw it otherwise. :) He would also explode over small things...spilled pizza (I was "ordered to clean it up to teach me a lesson") and cussed at in front of his and my children. He would later seem apologetic but also claimed he was provoked. Right. Notice how he doesn't take responsibility for himself. Even if you did provoke him, it is his responsibility to choose to go there - or not.

He would ignore me as if he never heard me. It was the strangest thing to look someone is the eye and get only a blank stare.. If he talked with me, he was doing me a favor. Lots of entitlement... My father also had become very ill and never asked how he was. When I asked him why, his response was, "There are allot of people more sick in this world than your father. Do I have to ask every 5 minutes?" Of course your father can't be of more concern to you than he is, no matter what!!!  My father died a week later. I'm so sorry... He was more concerned about his heavy workload and chronic headaches that week. These are just a few things that occurred the first 10 days. I took my daughters and left. Good for you! It would have only gotten worse.

I am still hurt that this relationship did not work - although I know it wouldn't of been like I had dreamed it would. Was I just fooled all along about who he really was? Yes. The irony is that you generally won't see the abuse until you're emotionally invested. The partner tends to put their best foot forward during the chase. Once you give your heart, the partner feels entitled to get what they really want/feel entitled to (like 24/7 emotional caretaking from you) and/or may feel internally frightened of the intimacy, needing to push you away.  Why do men turn around and claim their partner was actually the abuser when they are confronted? You are describing a pathological process first articulated in psychoanalytic theory called "projection."  While a little of anything is OK, some emotionally immature individuals  are unable to accept their own shortcomings. They deny their own unacceptable impulses and project them onto other. These individuals will accuse you of what they in fact are guilty of. Projection is a common defense mechanism in narcissistic styles, which is roughly where this guy seems to live given his sense of entitlement. 

In abuse with entitlement issues, you are likely to be accused of abuse when confronting your partner. But when you pick apart exactly how you abused them, it makes little sense. You will often find that THEIR needs/wishes/hopes/etc. matter; yours are secondary. So, as an extreme example, you may be seen as abusive if your sick dad is more on your mind than your partner is; you are somehow neglecting him.

There is little emotional reciprocity and little empathy. Your partner may fake it for a while, but cannot sustain empathy - genuine caring and concern for your feelings. Your emotional issues simply don't matter if they compromise what you give him, even if you are dealing with a sick father. And there will always be a superficially plausible explanation of why .

Be thrilled you escaped early. Good luck to you, Dr. Irene


Monday February 02, 2009
09:10 PM

Hi Dr. Irene, I'm confused with grief. I thought I found my soul mate, crazy about him. we were church friends. He's a substance abuser, unemployed & homeless. 2 years ago he got work & a place because he wanted to be with me, start a real life. We're both excited, happy. Sobriety is harder to get than a job, and he'd get mean verbally when drunk, & also withheld affection. I broke it off with him to get my head straight. He came back so sweet, so I figured it was the alcohol. He tried white knuckling again, but then he disappears. He returned homeless & unemployed. I was happy he was alive, took him in & told him it was temporary, he had to get help for his substance abuse & get on his feet; I was being a friend cause he needs one but we had to take our romance slow cause he's sick. So for 80+ days of his sobriety he is who I fell in love with. That may have been easy as I loved him more than anything & was good to him, taking care of him when sick, being a therapist, mom, etc. That month, my 18 year old cat died, my car blew up & on his sobriety day 87 I lost my job. I'm so sorry... I was sick with fever AND premenstrual - so he became enraged because I wasn't my sunny self. I patiently told him please back off I'm unwell. He yelled I was a bitch. I threw my water in his face, this escalates & he's in my face screaming I slap at his head & he tosses me into the DVD rack. Now he's another being. For over an our he is terrorizing me with his fist in my face, SCREAMIN fat c*&^ wh&^*, & bi*&*. Spitting in my face, said he'd kill me over & over. He was forced to leave. I changed my ph. number. It's been over a month I'm still shocked & I miss who I thought he was(GENTLE&SWEET). How do I let this go in my head? He said the end was my fault because I slapped him, and I feel bad, but blew a fuse. I feel so sad to think I would spend my life with him & it end so ugly. When somebody shows their sweet side (during the honeymoon phase and/or when we are doing doing doing for them), we love it! We think we found Heaven! BUT, as time goes on, especially when the chips are down, sometimes we find out that this wonderful person has a monstrous side. You've seen side that a couple of times now. Addicts of any kind are a particular poor relationship risk unless they are years into their recovery.

Begin to let him go by realizing that both sides are him. You need to "radically accept" (google that phrase) who he is. Let him go too by understanding that blaming you for this fiasco is nonsense. More of his not taking responsibility. You are each responsible for your parts and someone terrorizing you for losing your cool, especially when you are down, is waaaaaay not OK. (Doesn't that make you mad? Even a little bit?)

Notice it when you find yourself moving into that wishful thinking space of how wonderful he can be. Spend a few moments each time you are reminded of your loss. It's OK to grieve. Feel the sadness - but only for a few moments. Then stop. You don't want to get caught up in empty recriminations; they are totally destructive and make you miserable. As a church-goer, you can give all those icky thoughts to God; He'll take them from you. Instead, purposefully redirect your attention to something in the here and now. Do something else. Wash dishes; vacuum, whatever - and give whatever you are doing your FULL attention. Be mindful. Stay in the moment. The next time the sadness comes up, do the same thing. Over and over.

Never forget that this man is both sides of himself, the good and the bad. Unfortunately the bad is simply too bad, so he's not a keeper. Remind yourself of that by writing down all the crummy stuff he's ever done to you. And read it, over and over when you are feeling weak. A friend is only a friend (or lover) when they can be there for you when you are down, as you were there for him. He can't do that.

Don't waste your precious energy bemoaning this loss. It would have only gotten worse. Look for someone who doesn't need a mommy and is capable of a reciprocal relationship the next time! Good luck and God bless! Doc


Thursday February 19, 2009
02:36 PM

Dear Dr Irene, I am an abuser in recovery. I wrote to you back in July 2007 when I was going through a relapse. I came out of an abusive relationship quite a number of years ago and about 4 years ago I was empowered to change my ways. When I look back, it happened in a single moment as I was working one day when I realised things no longer needed to be the way they were. I have since been working on change. Excellent! It has been a difficult journey… since I wrote to you things changed drastically again. In carrying fear consciously I again began to empower myself. I was entering situations and rather than reacting I either did nothing or the complete opposite… I could feel the wounds that were driving my behaviour….they were (and still are) terrifying… Yes. Isn't it crazy to hold yourself hostage over fears? In feeling the anxiety and feeling terrified but not reacting it gave me a great sense of being… Yes! I was again relating and connecting with people, really listening and it felt totally different energetically. I began to have a deeper sense of self and understood about my path… it was a strange experience but it was like I had actually connected with ME. YES!

As ever there is a but… over the last three months or so I have begun to start slipping back, a sort of anxiety just crept in and as much as I have been trying to keep it in check it has slowly crept further in till now I feel I have taken two steps back again and I’m back to just surviving rather than living and being. You need to let yourself feel the fear, but not stay stuck in it. Feel the fear for a few moments each time it comes up. And let it go. Not spin it with your mind... Consciously redirect your thoughts after you have spent a few moments in the fear. Over time, this teaches you to deal with the pain and fear. It loses its power, eventually.

I feel full of emotion and now spend some of my evenings with a heavy feeling of tears behind my eyes. Sounds like there may a lot of grief too... I have been through so much and seen so many changes in me and how I am, there is no way I am ever going back to the man I was. I guess I’m just scared that I won’t make it. Of course you're frightened! Feel that fear, then let it go. Know too that you have to work through many layers of this stuff. So even though you did lots of work, you have simply reached a new level, where the same stuff is there, but at a more subtle level. You would not have noticed it at this level earlier. The feelings and thoughts will be the same. Continue the work. You will find many levels where you are essentially reworking the same issues - but at subtler and subtler levels. You will think you have fallen back, but you haven't. Think back. I bet the kind of stuff that set you off initially does not have the same hold on you. But subtler manifestations of same do. You will work many levels - until one day, there are no more.

This anxiety just crept in insidiously and when I do get out of this rut it could always come again and I could relapse again. It IS insidious. Practice being mindful of your thoughts and feelings, being more and more self aware. The only thing you need to control is your tendency to flee from experiencing the icky feelings. Feel them. A few moments. Then let that process go by consciously redirecting your attention to the present. Over and over, no matter how many times the "stuff" comes up. A wonderful though somewhat esoteric book on mindfulness is Wherever You Go, There You Are : Mindfulness Meditation in Everyday Life  by Jon Kabat-Zinn Anger by Thich Nhat Hanh. is another to look at.

Don't give up. You just have to keep at it!  Wishing you the very best, Doc


Monday February 23, 2009
01:49 PM

Hello Dr Irene, This my third post about this man - the last was to the interactive board. Anyway I think I’m ok but there were some things that I would like your take on. It helps to make sense of things. I did go and work with a psychotherapist as suggested and I did find it helpful. Excellent!

What I did uncover was basically that because of my abusive childhood I had become quite used to odd behavior from people and so didn’t remove myself. Yep. Agreed. Also that I had a lot of shame about being the age that I am and not having formed a mature emotional and physical relationship with anyone. Very understandable. Given our culture, many people with your experience would likely feel the same way. I think this last point is one of the things that the man I had difficulty with used to manipulate me. :(  Manipulators tend to be very adept at finding exactly the stuff that deeply affects you.

What bothers me is the psychotherapist kept saying I was masochistic. Something I feel horrified about as there would be no hope for me. OK. Stop. You said two things: 1. The idea horrifies you and 2. It horrifies you because there would be no hope. I really do feel that I just was attracted to the really nice bit but the therapist has said that because I had had a lot of pain as a child that is what attracted me to him and that I wouldn’t know it. Is this possible ?

This is YOUR fear; YOUR pain; YOUR burden. You own it. That is OK. Don't run from it. You need to deal with this very real hurt (which is probably associated with shame, helplessness, and only you can know what else).

More therapy will help. The way you speak, it sounds as though you finished with the therapy you were involved with. While there are many roads that lead to Rome, I am an ACT therapist, so I will give you a simplified overview of one way to begin working this issue via that approach. Consider a DBT therapist as well. You don't have to suffer from BPD to benefit from the pearls widely available Dialectic Behavior Therapy has to offer. In fact, any of the "mindfully-based behavioral therapies" (google it) are a good bet.

Each time something reminds you of this stuff, sit with the pain for a few moments. Not the thoughts (e.g., "there is no hope for me" ; "I am a masochist"), but the feelings - the plain and simple horror and fear and helpless pain you feel in your body. If you close your eyes and pay attention, you may be able to find where this pain resides in your body. Do not dwell on the icky thoughts no matter how "normal" it seems to go there. There is nothing there for you; you've spent far too much time there already. After a few moments of feeling the pain, consciously direct your attention elsewhere, to something in the present. Stay in the present. Note that it's  very easy to mix up feelings with thoughts and to slip from feelings into thoughts without realizing you've gone there. You have to learn how to do this stuff!

The Human mind is real tricky by nature. We are usually on "autopilot" and are not self-aware as a rule. Look for mindfulness classes, pick up an ACT workbook  (e.g., Get Out of your Mind and Into Your Life: The New Acceptance & Commitment Therapy) by Steven Hayes, PhD  and a book on mindfulness, (e.g. Wherever You Go, There You Are : Mindfulness Meditation in Everyday Life .) But a real live therapist is a far, far better way to go.

Repeated exercises like this will help you accept your painful feelings the same way you accept it when your body has a cold. You are sick and therefore feel icky. Period. You don't spend tooooo long bemoaning the fact that you have this awful cold and how terrible that is and how your life is ruined and there is no hope for you, blah blah blah.

On the "masochist" word. Unfortunately that word gets tossed around far too much, has far too much baggage attached to it, and is not useful nor helpful. Your therapist's use of the word is probably more a function of his/her theoretical orientation than much else. As a behaviorist, as opposed to a psychodynamically-oriented therapist, I don't use that term. Regardless of orientation, clinicians working in abuse also tend not to use it. We recognize that a victim does not set out to be abused.

People do what they already know. It is normal. You learned to worry more about others than to worry about yourself. You chased love as though it was the carrot at the end of a stick. You could never catch it because those around you, for whatever reason, were unable to parent you. So you long for love, and chase it. You tend to be too loyal, too trusting, and put up with way too much - because that is what you know; that is "normal" to you. Look at some of the symptoms of codependency here, content taken from Melody Beatty's classic bestseller, Codependent No More. Also, look at some of the other pages in the codependency section as well as elsewhere.

The second thing is about this man's personality disorder. The therapist thought antisocial and narcissistic. In a few of the conversations with Mark since closing contact his comments have included : I don’t owe anyone anything, I do what I want when I want , I’m different from anyone else, you will never meet anyone like me, you need to look at what's wrong with you rather than me (this one I agreed with Me too :) ). I will never get caught doing anything wrong, no one will want you, If I’d ever f....d you you’d have always wanted more!,. I said ‘OK’ then he flipped back in to very normal, convincingly charming and pursued+++. I think he used my vulnerability to manipulate and exploit me but he was very good and convincing. I’m sure its personality disorder but which one? There's no way for me to know. Not nearly enough information here, though narcissistic or antisocial would certainly fit. Besides, you only get *one* specific question in this format. Kind regards, thanks so much for your help before- I'm feeling good :-) Emma  Wishing you the very, very best Emma. I know the work sometimes feels endless, but just keep at it. You've nothing to lose and everything to gain. You can do it!  Doc

 

Date: Wednesday February 25, 2009

Time: 10:40 PM

 

Dr. Irene, I am 40 and have been with my husband for 11 years total. What I am going to describe was not everyday life because we do have similar interests, but I feel these occurrences are severe enough that I need your opinion.

 

My husband has always been controlling: no friends can call house, dictated where I should go, etc. He insults my friends and has told me that they just use me for their own benefit. I have over the years grown apart from my friends due to our relationship and his control issues and jealousy. He has said multiple times it is them or me and has blatantly tried to end my friendships and admitted to wanting to do this. My friends have warned me that I am in an unhealthy relationship while my husband tells me that they are just miserable and jealous of us.

 

He also has a bad temper and has been fired from job for threatening a coworker. He invades people's personal space and boundaries if he feels someone is "talking down to him". There have been some instances of physical abuse, I guess. He would lay on top of me with all his weight so I couldn't move and when I told him to get off of me screaming he would say I need to control my mind and relax. He has also put a pillow over my face when I disagreed with him and held it there until I screamed and he said it was a joke. I hope you are crystal clear with the knowledge that not only is anything like this remotely funny, but is dangerous. Abuse escalates over time. Know that. 

 

Over the last two years, he has had a severe drug addiction, spending our savings and losing his job. He is currently 5 weeks sober. As I write this I feel sick about myself and fear that he has damaged my self esteem so badly I will never get out. I need confirmation that regardless of the good times, these issues are unacceptable. Why would I stay? What is wrong with me?

 

These issues are entirely unacceptable. 100% unacceptable - and very serious. Your husband strikes me as a dangerous person. He is jealous, controlling, and has anger issues that have seriously affected his life. He has already jeopardized your physical integrity. He "relaxes" by subjecting you to control and intimidation in a physically hurtful manner. Therefore, not only does he lack empathy (which is a serious sign of pathology itslef), but he is pleased by your pain! This suggests sociopathy, aka "antisocial personality disorder." Having something like this happen even once, is inexcusable. Add addiction to this volatile combination and the mix is - more likely than not - a time bomb. You are in danger. You wanted my opinion? That's it.

 

Why should you stay? Absolutely no reason.

 

What is wrong with you? The same thing that is wrong with many, many other individuals throughout the world. Abuse is a difficult statistic to measure. According to the US Justice Department, victims are often reluctant to report violence because of shame and/or fear of reprisal, especially since domestic violence tends to occur in private.

 

Why do you stay? Abused individuals are faced with making huge life changes at a time when they are at their lowest point:

 

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Studies  indicate that the main reason women stay in abusive marriages is due to lack of finances. Controlling spouses help ensure partner entrapment by limiting financial access.  

 

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Not only is money controlled, but typically, as in your case, the abuser has limited the partner's social

support network. Victims are not likely to confide the abuse to anyone out of shame and fear. There is virtually no support.

 

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Victims also tend to suffer from the mental and physical effects secondary to the STRESS of abuse. On the

 mental side, depression and anxiety are nearly universal symptoms among victims. Keep in mind that depression is characterized by increased indecision, self-doubt, diminished self-esteem, excessive guilt, and more. These symptoms are treatable.

 

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Google "the general adaptation syndrome" to get an idea of how excessive stress affects the body. In short,

abuse kills. *Sigh*

 

You may not be ready to consider leaving, and that's OK. But DO:

 

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Call the police if abuse (including jokes) occurs. Remember, abuse escalates. "Jokes" and "mistakes" count.

The law takes  abuse seriously. Report the crime, even if it is the morning after.

 

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Get in touch NOW, today, with your local women's shelter. Your case is not "too mild." They can

help you by arming you with information, support, a safety plan, legal advice, etc., etc. If you can't locate a shelter, call the county or city court or sheriff or police. They can help.

 

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Start posting on the CatBox. There is lots of emotional support for you there.

 

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Do not let on that you are exploring these avenues, even if you have to go to the Library to get online or

make phone calls from a public phone.

 

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You ARE in danger.

 

Thankfully there are many, many resources available today. PLEASE use them!

 

Sending you many warm fuzzies and good wishes... Doc

 

 

Date: Sunday March 1, 2009

Time: 10:40 PM

 

You say in your Dana article that a cunning narcissist can hide the narcissism from the people most meaningful to her - her parents, boss, husband, sibling, etc.  I get the parents, boss, siblings. They all hate me for “abusing” her!   I completely broke down and lost all my friends, career, was obsessed with her. It nearly destroyed me. 

 

The way you describe Dana is exactly my life with MyDana.  Gradually she became less and less concerned with how I felt about anything and she did nothing to raise my rank among other men in the sense of showing she was taken.  Not one picture of me on facebook, countless texts and calls from men.  I repeatedly asked to simply be introduced.  I didn’t care that she had male friends, but it seemed she had two worlds.  Us, and the rest of her life.  She continually would be hot for 3 days, cold for 3, and the more I tried to get an I love you from her, the crueler and more distant she became, but if it appeared I was leaving,  she’d send long, gushing emails begging forgiveness and throwing herself on the sword telling me how terrible she’d been, only to return - worse; it seemed she was resentful for ever apologizing.  Yep. She had contempt towards you, but not enough to lose what you offered. In retrospect, do you see all the signs in what you describe? Knowing what you know now, would you stay so long again? If this relationship was happening to your close friend, would you suggest to him that he stay?

 

I’ve done some boundary work since then and realize my role in this Excellent!, but you have to understand how convincing she could be. I do! Some people are excellent manipulators! Nevertheless, you can't be manipulated unless you buy into it, so there are good lessons here for you. Each time I’d believe that we really would work it out.  See the wishful thinking? You repeatedly believed her words instead of her actions. My sanity slipped away and she apparently told her friends and parents she was in an abusive relationship so they all hated me. Yep.  Over time I grew to resent her behavior and should have walked away. Yep. I was angry when she’d pull her stunts, but I was very, very kind to her: the boyfriend that tried to hard as you described.  Sure. By not knowing when to draw the line, you inadvertently enable her antics. The only "right" thing you could have done is leave. I could go on and on about the hot/cold and the lies, her saying she’d do something and never doing it, her never buying me a birthday card and saying she was making one or making a gift - which never materialized. She had no friends except the no self esteem childhood friend EXACTLY like Dana - and the male admirers who all told me I’d better take good care of her. It used to make me cringe…if they only knew the real her!.

 

My question is: how can a narcissist hide it from her husband?  Easily! The narcissist can hide from anyone s/he can manipulate. But manipulation takes energy, so as your importance to her diminishes, she will expend less energy putting her best foot forward. Wouldn’t he be the object of her scorn, either b/c he tries to win her and is viewed as less than and common, or if he doesn’t give her narcissist supply, then he’s of no use, right?  Certainly! It is very flattering to be loved sooooo much that you are wanted no-mattere-what! Even if she stepped on you, you were there, trying to work things out. You gave her one benefit of the doubt after the other because she was sooooo special. It seems that, over time, as your upset increased, your adoration diminished. Plus, you lost your "trophy factor" in losing your job, friends, etc. As the cost/benefit ratio of how much she had to "work"/what she got in return dwindled, she could afford to give you up - and blame you for it in the process. :(. I just can’t imagine a mate being spared, b/c in my involvement with MyDana, it seemed I bore the brunt of her ickyness while her family, boss, her childhood friend with no esteem, and the many, many men that wanted her thought her to be a perfect angel. Thanks!

 

A husband can certainly be the object of narcissistic scorn, and is the likely target if the narcissistic individual is no longer getting what s/he wants from their partner. As long as the needs are being met (on both sides), the relationship can work. Think of the old stereotype: trophy wife and rich guy. Or, brilliant woman who marries for political / financial ties. Or, if you were a "harder" person than she is, you could "make" her work for your affection while you provide the financial base. There is no limit to what the couple may exchange. A long-term "deal" with a narcissist works best if both partners have similar characteristics. They understand each other. Doesn't seem you were cut out for such a partner. Good for you!

 

You may find Loving the Self Absorbed a good read.

 

I'm glad for that YourDana is history. Best wishes, Doc

 

 


Monday March 16, 2009
03:41 PM

Dr. Irene, I have been in a relationship for 2 ½ years. We have been friends on and off since I was 16. Twenty years later we ran into each other and jumped into a relationship. I knew of his domestic violence background, but as friends he always treated me with respect, he made me feel special, like I mattered; he was different with me. It wasn't long into our relationship that his true character came out, but I thought it would change. I thought it would be different between us. He has a quick temper when he is tired, sick, hungry, or needs a cigarette. He has called me names, with words I had never heard before, belittled me, yelled at me, cussed me out, hung up on me, slammed the door in my face, called me over and over so many times (one evening I had 45 missed calls), had me paged at work 96 times in 1 day, threatened me, to destroy my car, to steal my cat, to have ME arrested, picked up my dry cleaning and refused to give it to me, blocked me in a court so I couldn't go anywhere. I can go on and on.

He makes me think I am crazy. He tells me that he didn't say what I remember him saying, then I wonder if the conversation really happened, when I think it happened. I have gone back to him 12 times. I filed a restraining order against him last year, before he was served with it, he talked me into dropping it, and I did. I used to be strong, independent, the person that kept it all together, the person everyone went to, an overachiever, a mom my adult kids looked up to and respected. Today my mind is mush.

I don't know what reality is anymore. There are many times I can't function. He has I let him destroyed who I am, who I used to be. And I still love him. I still miss him. I still wonder if it can work. I've had headaches, migraines, and anxiety for more than a year now. I feel as though I have nothing left. This is crazy, right? What did I do to deserve this? Why would I love someone that treats me with such disrespect and disregard? He's a little nice for 2 days and a creep for 5 days. Why do I stay? How do I keep myself from going back? How do I keep myself from falling for his manipulation to win me over? The good news is that it seems you have clearly established that he is bad for you. It seems you categorically understand that there is no way in the world that this man has anything to offer you other than heartache. Good. That makes it clear.

So, lets compare him to any pleasurable but noxious entity. He is your vice. Your narcotic. And, it is not possible with this vice to have a little of it. He is "on" or "off." So, you can't have only one glass of red wine at dinner with this guy. You have the whole bottle, or you have none. You can't have a slice of that luscious dessert. You have all of it, or you have none.

Conceptualizing him as your addiction, and understanding you can't even have a taste of this addiction, the sooner you notice you are thinking of him, wondering what it might be like "this" time, wishing it could be since, after all, you love him...

It is time to consciously and purposely move your mind away from these thoughts. Keep this thinking up and you will likely make the choice to see him/talk with him/pick up the phone/etc. again.

It is OK to have thoughts of missing him whenever anything reminds you that you miss him. It is OK to feel the love you have for him. It is not OK to choose to continue allowing your mind to drift towards this type of thinking - because you are likely to choose destructive action soon. 

Learn to be mindful of what is on your mind. Pay attention. Notice your reverie.

The pain that wells up when you are reminded of your toxic love is your body's natural response. Feel it. Feel the pain as pain is a natural part of life. And then let it go. Let the thoughts go and redirect your mind and body to a place in the here and now that is productive for you. Choose to go to a healthy place. Of course, you may choose not to, but you already know where that will take you....

Gee, I love chocolate and anything sweet. If I give in to each urge, I will very quickly be much, much fatter than I already am. That's my choice.

This guy is Your Choice.

This is a great book to help you learn mindfulness skills: Wherever You Go, There You Are : Mindfulness Meditation in Everyday Life

Thank you for your help.  Honestly, the only help I can give you is the push to help yourself. God bless, Dr. Irene  

 

Friday March 27, 2009
07:51 AM

My wife shows signs of BPD. I love her dearly, and want her to get help. We are separated and a divorce is filed. As is typical with BPD, I am the problem, she verbally degrades me in volcanic eruptions, and she denies that her troubled childhood and past bad relationships have harmed her. 

The question that haunts me is this: Is my wife really capable of loving me? I don't know, and it doesn't really matter... She has had a lot of previous relationships, been engaged often but never followed through. Falls in love fast. This is not love; this is infatuation. I am so different than anyone else she has ever been with, but she tells me that is why she wanted me. I am very good to her and loving toward her. But that seems to repulse her. For myself, I need to know if I'm just another guy that has come along through the revolving door of her heart, or is it possible that I do have something that attracted her, that is different, unique, and what she has been looking for? I'm trying to figure out if I should hang in there, or throw in the towel. No one else has ever been able or willing to bring her to the point of facing her hurt and get help.

This is not about your wife at all. This is about you. Your wife's impulsivity and mood-driven choices are about her. Her ability or inability to tolerate the normal "sacrifices" which come with mature love are about her. You have no control over that, so please don't worry about it.

You are basically asking if you should hang in there because maybe, just maybe, you are special enough to her that your love may help her change. But her healing has little to do with your specialness. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

The choice you face regarding whether or not you stay in this marriage is yours and yours alone. But do make this decision in the light of day. Make it knowing that you have no control over her. Make it knowing how much you can and cannot deal with in terms of her behavior towards you. Make it knowing that loving this woman is a wonderful gift you can give to her, but - have no expectations in return. There are no guarantees. No one has a crystal ball.

Search your heart and soul to better understand your hopes and expectations. Understand what you can and cannot deal with. There are no right or wrong answers. Be honest with yourself. Take your time. This wonderful little book on mindfulness (self-awareness) may help you better understand yourself: Wherever You Go, There You Are : Mindfulness Meditation in Everyday Life by Jon Kabat-Zinn.

Wishing you and yours the very best. Dr. Irene


Saturday June 06, 2009
09:04 PM


Saturday June 06, 2009
09:04 PM

Dear Dr. Irene, I am married (almost 10 years now) and have just recently, within the last 6 months, realized that I am in an emotionally abusive relationship.

I always thought he just had a really bad temper and angered easily. In the 10 years we've been together he has never had a satisfying job and I always told myself "maybe when he gets a job he likes things will get better". But that has not ever happened. He has always yelled a lot, and is now doing that to our 6 year old son. The fact that he started doing that to our son (literally yelling at him to shut up) is what made me open my eyes and seek counsel with a few close friends and then with my pastor. From them I first heard the term "emotional abuse". I began to realize how often he criticizes me and how he puts me down in front of other people. He is a very selfish person and has absolutely NO empathy for others.

Looking back at his childhood I can see why he is the way he is. His dad was physically and verbally abusive and his mother took the brunt of that, in front of the kids. The dad was also abusive to the 3 kids and my hunch is that their mom never did anything about that. My husband has a very strained relationship with his parents now. Understandably.

He also has a history of viewing pornography on the computer, which I've addressed many times with him to no avail. I caught him on it just a few days ago. My pastor has not been of much help in counseling us, I think partly because he himself had a bad relationship with his father growing up, and he also has openly admitted to having anger and temper issues - but he manages to keep them under control, by the grace of God. But sometimes I wonder if he doesn't more take the side of my husband because of his own past. My husband has faith in God, but I am amazed at how he can act like he is a faithful servant of God while at church, and turn around and be totally the opposite in how he lives his life. He hears the Word, but does not apply it to his life. I cannot understand that. Maybe you can pick up the DVD, Fireproof and convince your pastor to give it to him. He should watch it alone. It's about a Christian couple; the husband overcomes an internet porn problem and makes enough changes to save his marriage. But maybe that won't help either.

I have friends I can talk with, but still feel like I don't know what to do. I know that God would not want my marriage to end, but unless my husband makes big changes I don't see a future for us. Ever since I opened up my feelings to others, I feel very empty inside. Sure. Because as you bring the issue out of denial and into the light, it becomes more real. But that's OK. You can't fix anything until you really understand it. I know that I should be forgiving, as God has forgiven me, and be willing to work with my husband but I don't feel anything for him. The mantra is "forgive but don't forget. The problem with forgiving is that it is very difficult to forgive when the abuse is ongoing. No love. Nothing. Is this my way of protecting myself, by pulling back and allowing myself to not want to feel anything for him anymore? I think it is pretty normal to feel angry and to shut down when you are being treated as you are. I'm not even sure I could ever love him again. No need to anticipate what you will feel tomorrow. Tomorrow will come soon enough and you will find out.

 I bought a great book The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing  by Dr. Beverly Engel, "The Emotionally Abusive Relationship" that has really opened my eyes. Yes, its a great book! I can absolutely see myself in the pages of those being abused, and my husband in the pages of the abuser. I've tried and tried to get him to read just a few pages, but he refuses. He will not admit that he is an abuser. I don't think counseling is going to work for us, he seems very reluctant to even try it. Is there any hope without counseling?  There is always hope.

I've been told he will need ALOT of counseling and that it will take a long time. I am tired, so tired, of years of living like this. And now that the issue is out in the open our relationship is even more strained. He blames me for our trouble, says that by my not communicating any of this for so long that the trouble we are now facing is all MY fault. Nonsense. He needs to take responsibility for himself. It takes two to Tango. In your case, he's being icky and you are letting it continue. How was I supposed to communicate with him whenever I tried to talk to him he just gets angry and defensive and manages to twist around what I say? He also constantly pressures me for sex, and I give in to him even though it means nothing to me. My pastor suggested to me that I should give my husband sex for 2 weeks straight and "pretend" that it means the world to me. He said that would soften him up and make him easier to live with. I just cannot do it. It feels bad enough when he demands it, but to voluntarily give in and then try to pretend that it means something to me is beyond my willingness. Is that wrong to feel that way? Of course not. Feelings are not "right" or "wrong." They simply are. Hear them. A sexual relationship is an act of union and love. Why would you expect to want to engage sexually with him in the absence of a loving relationship? When sex becomes an obligation that meets one partner's "needs," to the emotional or physical detriment of the other, the latter person is likely to feel used and unwilling. If your husband were more mindful of your feelings, he would not want to have sex with you if were unwilling. When he wants sex from me now I just dread it. I feel fine when I am not around him, but as soon as he comes home from work, or on the weekends when he is here at home I feel like there is a huge weight on my shoulders and I am so unhappy. Other than separation, I cannot think of any other way to be happy again. And I really want peace and happiness in my life. I don't know what to do.

Separation is certainly an option. Clearly he won't see what he doesn't have to see. Often it takes a "major event" for such an individual to open their eyes, such as a spouse who leaves, or an arrest because somebody heard the yelling and called 911. He didn't change, you did! As your eyes open wider, you became more and more unhappy. And you can - and should - continue to change what you think and feel, whether you remain with him or not.

You say, "How was I supposed to communicate with him whenever I tried to talk to him he just gets angry and defensive and manages to twist around what I say?" The answer is that you are powerless. There is nothing you can say to get through to him. While you are asking him to change for good reasons, you are still asking him to change. And he doesn't want to. You don't have the right to force change in him anymore than he has the right to force change in you. I think you should instead ask yourself if you can accept him as he is, or if you should consider leaving if you can't. Perhaps your own, individual therapy is a good way for you to explore that question, along with codependency self-help groups, even retreats.

You say, "I feel fine when I am not around him, but as soon as he comes home from work, or on the weekends when he is here at home I feel like there is a huge weight on my shoulders and I am so unhappy." Of course there is a huge weight on your shoulders. Luckily, you put it there. You are the one who creates your thoughts and feelings, not him. Every time he walks through the door, you slip into a post traumatic stressy reaction. This is not to imply in any way that you are doing something "wrong," but simply to point out that given your experiences with him, negativism is what you emotionally default to. Your reaction is purrrfectly normal. You choose to dread that he is back.  I know your dread does not feel like a choice, but despite the fact that you go there unconsciously, you still (choose) to go there. Why do I say "Luckily?" Because since it is your thought/feeling, you can change it! Why depend on him to remove it when He can help you do that? :D

You can work on your reactions to him in counseling. The ideal is for you to learn to be so disengaged that you simply don't care much anymore because you no longer feel the need to pacify him, please him, have sex with him, etc. This is not easy to do, but embarking on this path will bring you many healing emotional rewards that you can take with you anywhere you go. There are lots of stops between here and Nirvana that you may call home, but I certainly advise embarking on the trip!

So, you see, there is no easy answer. Are you right to feel dread when he comes home or approaches you for sex? Of course! Why wouldn't you if you know you are going to make yourself endure whatever you think it is you have to do. But what if you felt no obligation to endure anything? Don't you think his yelling and demands would eventually taper once he realizes they no longer get a rise out of you and no longer get him what he wants? Would you ever have a partner if you changed and he didn't change? Of course not, unless he changed. Would he change if you did? Who knows.

On the other hand, you may choose to separate, and who could blame you? Maybe he'll be upset enough to get help. Maybe not. Nevertheless, you have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. You certainly will feel lighter and relieved once you're out. But you will also have the issues associated with divorce/separation such as diminished finances, family/kid issues, etc. And you will still need to deal with your post traumatic stressy reactions to situations that even mildly remind you of your abuse.

So, why not take your time in making this important decision, and start on the path to emotional freedom while you're at it. Consider everything and shore up your emotional, financial, separation strategy, legal, etc. issues during this time so that if you do leave, you are prepared.

So, do get yourself some individual counseling and find a group like Codependent's Anonymous, get some legal advice, etc. etc. And pick up this wonderful little book that will help just about any Christian with forgiveness, The Shack . The problem with anger, no matter how well justified (and yours certainly is!), is that it does nothing to affect your target, it only burdens your own heart and hurts you. Forgive yourself too, as God does, for feeling as you do. Your thoughts and feelings are a natural reaction to the situation you are in. You CAN deal with this.

God bless you and yours, Dr. Irene

 


Tuesday June 23, 2009
12:57 AM

I have been married for 10 years and we have 5 kids; the oldest from a previous relationship. Ever since the beginning of our marriage, my husband has never taken accountability for his actions within the marriage and has always over-reacted to even the most basic of issues.

Six months ago, I asked him to go see a counselor, which he did and then we started going together. At that time, we both started taking antidepressants. Since then, he doesn't allow me to bring up our therapy sessions, he doesn't believe me when I tell him things my dr. or individual therapist has said. He says I've abandoned the family (because I told him that if things don't change, I can't stay married) and uses that against me by withholding info concerning our kids and the functioning of the house and family. He calls the police or the distress line when I get upset about something that he's done. When I tell him my feelings, he dismisses them and says all I want is control. When we fight and I want to take the kids away from the house, he either blocks the driveway with his vehicle so I can't leave or he says he's going to call social services on me and charge me with kidnapping.

He has also taken my hard drive and all the paperwork from my van (taxes, medical receipts, bills, therapy notes) saying that I must be hiding something and he's going to find out what it is. Communication with him has been the following: intimidating, controlling, confusing, interrupting, echoing, changing the subject to avoid answering questions. He tape records our conversations only on his terms. He threatens to close our joint bank account and change his will but then denies ever saying that. He refuses to discuss anything and says all I want to do is fight. We haven't resolved one conflict ever in our marriage. He is emotionally unavailable to me and to the kids. Is he just emotionally immature or is he verbally abusive and what can I do?

First of all, see an attorney to understand what your legal rights and obligations are so you may plan ahead should in the event you decide to leave.

Here's the problem: the guy you married was difficult from day 1 of your marriage. He hasn't changed; your ability to tolerate his antics has. And from what you say, he's blocked any hope of changing, which unfortunately is his right, but puts you in a difficult situation. This is sad, but it is what it is.

You can't change him. You can only change yourself. Either you learn to detatch emotionally, accept what is, and make the most of your life within your marriage, or begin planning an exit strategy. I strongly suggest learning to detach even if you leave.

Ironically, changes you enact in your own life will likely lead to changes in how he handles your marriage. These changes may be for the better or for the worse. Perhaps he will wake up and get some help; perhaps not. The point is that you can't force change in him, so don't even try, but he will likely change as you do.

Do what you must to help yourself. What direction to take should be the topic of therapy discussion. Stay away from all he does to you or how he should be different. That won't help. Look at how to detach and rise above his words and actions.

I don't have enough information to provide relevant feedback regarding your husband's mental state, but his behavior is not healthy. So stop interacting with him at his level, where you take his controlling words and actions to heart, and carve out your own emotional path instead.

Ideally, first enact these changes in yourself, then decide whether to stay or go. Your attitude of freedom will accompany you wherever you go, with him or without him.

Good luck! Doc

 

Tuesday August 25, 2009
12:25 PM

Dear Dr. Irene, I am 40 and just opening my eyes to the fact that I have been controlling and verbally abusive after losing my girlfriend of three years. I started my relationship with her shortly after (less than a year) my divorce from the woman I was with for twenty years, who also said I was verbally abusive. I was never able to see what I was doing even though my wife and I had gone to counseling, but I see it all too clearly now and I am scared. This is good! I know it is scary, and while it doesn't feel good that is OK. You can't work on what you can't see! "Face the fear and the fear will disappear" should be something you write on your refrigerator so you are reminded whenever you open the door.

 I loved both of these women dearly and want to understand what made me behave this way so I don't hurt anyone else. I haven't been able to stop reading your site in search of answers. I am ashamed to say my behavior fits most of the checklists right down to anger when I thought her actions were not showing she "cared enough" and the panic feelings now that I realize that she really is gone. My question is this: Do I have to be a narcissist? Absolutely not! I have always felt that my many failures ( professional and personal) have been my fault , not someone else's. And when I read the narcissist's view of sex it was revolting. Sex was sacred and beautiful and made me feel connected and I never withheld it or felt it was a chore nor have I ever had the desire to cheat. There are many other aspects of the narcissist's profile that I can't identify with and some that I can. Am I being blinded by denial? More likely you're blinded by the deadly disease "Internet Self-Diagnosis-itis." Can I fit these abusive traits and behaviors so well and not be a narcissist? Yes! I have been diagnosed with depression and have been off meds when my behavior is worst, but after reading all this info I am finding it hard to pin it all on that. According to what I read, if I am a narcissist, I am doomed and incurable . Terrified, C

Dear C, Diagnosis of a personality disorder is tricky and often takes a while, and the way you write doesn't sound consistent to me with narcissism. Nevertheless, please stop with this doomed and incurable stuff. That's just not true. Anybody who truly wants to make changes in their behavior and commits to do so no matter what, will.

Abuse is about needing to control the other person, and the destructive tactics that are used to that end. People can be or appear controlling for many reasons: narcissism, borderline personality disorder, obsessive-compulsive personality, sociopathy to name a few. But people can also be or appear controlling because they are depressed and agitated, are OCD, or have an undiagnosed mild or not-so-mild bipolar disorder, or even just have insecurity issues they haven't yet dealt with. Etc. etc. etc.

So, stop the self-diagnosis because it is clearly sending you (more accurately: you are unwittingly sending yourself) spiraling into a depression that will only make things worse. Do yourself a favor. Go find a good clinician. Someone with an anger management specialty would be ideal, and work with them to figure out what makes you nutty and how to stop it. You can do this! Do it now!

Many regards and good wishes, Dr. Irene


Thursday August 27, 2009
09:24 PM

Dear Dr. Irene, I've been a fan of your site for many years. I need your no nonsense advice here! Hubby and I have been married for 16 years. Not all good, but getting better all the time as we get older. Here's the deal. When I met my husband, I found myself immersed into crazy-ville with his family. He is the oldest; next his brother George; next his sister Katie. Serious Jerry Springer stuff here: his whole life, him and his brother have been treated like second class citizens compared to his sister. As in, his parents didn't even celebrate him and his brother's birthdays because it wasn't an occasion for his sister.........but when her birthday would come around, we better break the bank for her! Wow! She has always been told: No one is more beautiful than her. No one is better than her. Anything she does is the right thing to do. She started having children (with losers who NEVER did anything for her or the kids) since she was 17. She is now 32. She has 3 children by 3 different men, no teeth, no money, herpes, has declared bankruptcy, had a house foreclosed upon, a car repo'd and had numerous financial judgments against her for everything from dental work to not paying rent. We are not from wealthy families and my in-laws have exhausted their money, house, 401k's to pay her way. They pay her rent, pay for her vacations, pay her bills, food, anything she wants.

My husband and I have co-signed on apartments, paid for dental work, bought her 2 cars, paid literally thousands of dollars a year paying for food, clothes, presents for her and her kids. All of which has been met with a f- you.............this is what you OWE her because you are family. She has never thanked us. She keeps asking for more. And when we have nothing more to give, she tells us to go f- ourselves. His parents support this, telling us, there is always more we could be doing for her. Literally, his parents expect us to "live our lives" for her like they do, because she has children. (We don't have kids, we are physically unable, which my mother-in-law has told me time and time again over the years doesn't make me a full human being.) Amazing... If we can't come up with more, we are the horrible ones. We are seriously expected to foot the bill for the kids, her and whatever man she's with at the time. We are supposed to pay her bills, buy her a house, keep her in a car, and thank her for the privilege.

We are never thanked, it's always, is that all? Here's the bottom line. After 16 years of supporting her and her children, my husband and I finally said, done. You know, we love the kids. And we are both working, but able to only pay OUR bills, not pay for another family of 5. It's about time! To top it off, whatever we have done for them is not acknowledged with thanks.........but, is that all? And if that's all, a resounding 'f- you!- from her and the parents. My husband's parents have now thrown down an ultimatum: if we are not going to pay her way, buy her a house and a car, pay for her, her boyfriend and her kids, all the while telling her how great she is and how proud we are of her, they no longer want to know us. We are no longer part of the family. Serious. Not exaggerating. Absolutely amazing. Talk about emotional/ financial abuse and manipulation!

His brother and his wife also have no children and are under the same standards as us............there is no reason they can't be "contributing" to her and the kids living. To which his brother and his wife are like, huh? We're barely making it ourselves and we don't' have kids either..........how does this make us responsible for another family? They are 100% correct. You guys owe his sister nothing. His sister makes no effort to better her life. She lives off welfare. His parents offered 3 times and we offered 2 times, live with us, we'll support you and your kids AND pay for you to go to school. But she wants to live the life she wants to live. I am happy for you that she didn't take you up on the offer! She doesn't want to gain a skill or education...........and she expects someone else to pay for all she wants and needs. not finished

Still, I feel guilty. Emotions should not be running your actions. Just think of what would happen every time you felt angry enough to kill somebody!  I see three kids in need. I've tried many times to talk with his sister and his mother and explain to them how we don't' have the resources to support them all, no matter how we would like to. I've offered everything from babysitting to having them live with us. Go to school. As long as you guys are going to be there to pick up the pieces, the sister will do as she pleases.  Better your life. Pay off your debts.. No matter what we offer, only lump sums of cash with no strings seem to be the ticket and if we can't come up with that, we are failing the entire family. Well, that's only if you buy into the mindset of the parents and the sister. Seems your husband's other brother knows better.

In the mean time, my husband and I are getting by with our own lives. My father passed away from cancer and now my mother is sick with cancer. My sister is a school teacher and her husband was hurt in a work accident 2 years ago that has led to high medical bills and him not working. We took care of my Dad and now we are taking care of my dying mother. Between my job, my bills, my immediate family, my mother, and my sister always on the brink of losing her house, I have no energy or resources to spare. Is it so bad to take care of myself, my husband and the sick and dying people in my life? Absolutely not! But still, the guilt is there: yes, this is family. Yes, these are children in need. My husband's parents basically raise his sister's children now, pay for their food, clothes, everything.................but there is still the constant pressure from them that we OWE then because they are family and his sister needs it and her kids need it. I know that she is an adult an in charge of her own life and children, but I feel for my husband, whose parents have turned their back on him because he can't turn over thousands of dollars a month to pay for another family. My overall question...........is this typical? No. Are we supposed to be taking care of all of them just because they are family? There is a difference between helping someone in a time of need to get on their feet, and perpetual support. Perpetual support, unless you can afford it and want to do it, is over the top for most people.

Is it wrong, when we don't have additional resources, to expect them to take care of themselves? Nope. I feel like I should be getting a second job sometimes and living in a box to provide for her kids. But then I am like, she had them, let her take care of them, and then I feel like I am a bad person for not doing EVERYTHING I can for her and those kids. You are a guilt-ridden individual that needs to get some help with the guilt! Isn't that the Christian thing to do? Give it your all? Am I wrong? I am a Christian, but I am not a Christian scholar. It seems to me Christianity urges individuals to take responsibility for themselves. The Bible always talks about (self) control. Your sister in law seems lacking here. It seems to me your generosity has gone over and above what would be expected of a Christian. It seems to me that you are at this point (and have been for quite some time) enabling this woman to continue living a self-centered life that does not take her children or herself, let alone God, into account. Her children are learning to rely on family handouts. Is this a good example? God gave us Free Will. She can choose her road. So can you. If you stop paying, there will be consequences. If you continue paying, there will be consequences. I don't think you are helping her by enabling her. When you care about someone more than they care about themselves, you are being codependent and allowing yourself to be manipulated emotionally by the sister and the parents. I think you need to get some help for your guilt. Emotion (guilt) should not be running your behavior. Love the person, not the behavior. I look to you for advice................ I really need some help on this and from reading posts from your site, I think I will get the no nonsense advice I need. I am not looking for a bargain or anything for free, if you have additional things to impart on me, at this point I am not looking to wheel and deal on additional input. Thank you, Susan


  

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